Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

"Destroy".... LOL They don't just kill them they Destroy them!!!! I gotta get my self a llama....

serious?

Absolutely!.....

Imagine a cross between a bad tempered camel and a midget with short arse syndrome

this i gotta look up!

google "alpacas as sentries".... actually breed specific "guard" lamas... about $500 an animal....

Good info Rupert.

We have problems with packs of semi-domestic dogs around here. If I had Alpacas in the pasture with sheep and goats which surrounds the chicken yard, then I would have security for all the animals.

Do Alpacas raise an alarm when threatened? I suppose the goats/sheep would be making some noise.

Another farm question. Feral cats live in my barn and handle rodent problems. They are totally wild and I do not approach them...a fine partnership. Now I plan to use one 10'x10' horse stall for 25 chickens. I plan to put chicken wire on the openings of the stall and a door and three windows on the South side into one of two 25'x20' chicken yards. One will be used for vegs and one for chickens alternating each year. Are the cats going to get the chickens when they are out in their yard?

I am off the AP subject for a moment, but it is all part of homesteading which is nearly on topic.

Cats are basically lazy Doug.... I'd be more concerned about them getting them in the stall, probably at night....

regarding using alpacas ....



Llamas are effective against coyotes and foxes, because they don't hunt in packs.....

Roving packs of "wild" dogs or wolves might be a problem for singular alpacas due to their smaller size than llamas, and even a llama might have problems defending against a pack....

I've read that alpacas are no good against packs of dogs; in fact, packs of dogs will probably kill a single alpaca. And a group of alpacas is less likely to 'mingle' with the herd; only single alpacas supposedly protect lambs after they get used to the herd.

I read that llamas are used succesfully against coyotes in the USA, but coyotes don't hunt in packs and llamas are almost twice the size of alpacas..

See http://www.llamas.co.nz/guard.htm

Xzorby.... just posted a cavaet along those lines (edited my post) as you were posting.... see above

Edited :

If you google "alpacas to guard sheep" you'll get the reference you found.... but all the quotes used reference experiences in the US with llamas and packs of wild dogs....

If you read further hits, most other references point to positive results

Mentioned alpacas, because they're used here in Australia and we don't have major problems with "wild" packs or wolves/coyotes..... mainly foxes

Llamas have been used in US against coyotes for years... as you say, coyotes don't usually run in packs....

Google "Guard Llamas" and you'll find heaps of info... here's a link to a university study...

Guard Llamas Study

Seems that many have had results that have proved sufficiently satisfactory to continue the use for predator control/reduction

I did find other (more positive) references as well, I'm just saying that alpacas are probably no good against a (pack of) dog(s).

Also, having more than one alpaca / llama would defeat the purpose, as they would stick together instead of seeing the sheep as 'family' and protecting them.

Furthermore, the study you posted a link to doesn't mention what llamas do against packs of dogs (or at least I couldn't find it). You might want to find more information on this, as the link I posted states that packs of dogs will probably even kill a llama.

Don't get me wrong, I'm just trying to help!

Or you could get a Great Pyrenees -- they sleep with the sheep and are pretty laid back unless they smell wolves. The thick hair on their bodies protects them from slashing bites and they are big enough to take a wolf down.

Hi everyone,

From what I've seen and read alpacas / llamas are very good for the smaller and single predators. They will chase off large dogs but the risk of them being injured is greater, llamas have the advantage of size. The biggest plus for alpacas / llamas is they eat what the sheep / goats do.

However, if you have packs of dogs / wolves I would recommend the "Big White Dogs" or "Guardian dogs". Some of these breeds are huge. They have been bread to defend against wolves and even bears in the countries they come from. There are quite a few breeds and some research should find an appropriate one. They will work alone, but for packs I'd recommend two or more, as one dog will move the flock / herd away while the other/s will raise the alarm and if the threat does not retreat, they will attack. Usually they are happy to see the threat run away but they have been known to kill wild dogs etc. that did not take the hint.

I did a lot of research when I had sheep, but then I moved...

Hope it helps someone else,

another intersting fact about alpacas is they all poo in the same spot, nice and tidy arnt they

My wife and I are proceeding cautiously. We want to see what level of animals is enough to care for. First we have the AP fish. Next a dog this summer. Then chickens next spring. Goats and sheep are a big step after that.

Our neighborhood is full of suburban kids with no animal care knowledge. Getting an animal sitter for any trip we want to take is difficult.

It seems like our travel days are over when we have a bunch of animals.

BTW, a note on my heat exchanger. I was waiting to get computer control working so it has been off until yesterday. With all the work outside the computer control has been on a back burner. So I hooked up a timer with 15min on and 15 min off during 9am to 5pm and off at night. The timer turns on a battery charger hooked to the 12 volt pump in my heat exchanger. First day of operation, the water temp is up one degree F from 65.3F to 66.3F. Previous temp increase was averaging 0.25F. This is not acceptable data to draw a conclusion. I will watch the numbers daily for a few weeks. Hard to seperate all the variables. Summer is approaching and every day brings more solar energy into the greenhouse, even without a heat exchanger. The ideal sequencing, I expect is more like 2 min on and 4 minutes off. That will be found when I have temperature sensors and a computer running the pump duty cycle.

I have 200 channel catfish and 200 hybrid blue gill. The formula I use for weight increase predicts they weigh about 6000 grams total and I am feeding 180 grams per day 90 morning and 90 evening. It appears they would eat more. I am pondering two things. One is weighing 5 of each to see if I have a good number for total weight and the other is feeding more (gradually) until they leave some uneaten. I have yet to net fish out of my tank and weighing seems difficult. Perhaps I can put them in some water in a container, then weigh the container, then remove the fish and reweigh the container. Any advice? If I feed until they leave some, I would assume that is 3% of total weight??? I do not know how good that assumption is. How do you appraise fish weight and feed amount? Especially those of you with a 100 or more fish to deal with (Jaymie?)

Weighing is hard, although the container method sounds good. Fish wiggle unless they are dead, and that plays havoc with getting a good weight. Keep feeding more until they leave some after 15 minutes, but watch ammonia and nitrite. That's a basic aquarium rule -- feed until satiation. I wouldn't assume that fish know how to calculate 3%. Also, if your fish fit the tilapia pattern, they eat a much higher % of body weight when young than when old. I think tilapia fry will eat 20% of body weight, while ones that are about eating-size will have cut back to 1-2%.

I'm keeping track of the total food I put in by the 44 lb sack. I will weigh the fish as I clean them. I'll be able to get some sort of FCR from that, but I'm not going to expect a high-efficiency commercial aquaculture type of yield.