Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Well it was rather a successful weekend. First off it stopped raining after about 3 weeks of rain.

Then I took Darrens advice and got another IBC which I cut to get a sump tank of 750 litres and another a third grow bed.

Then I did a rough set out laying out besser blocks and timber and setting up the grow beds with the sump underneath. Worked out all the locations and marked out the sump position and moved the pavers and started digging. I set the sump in about 300mm. Took a while and saved some of the coarse paving sand for the final levelling.



Got it all set up level and put it in place. Then I started on the framework for the grow bed supports. Got them all level and found a new use for the cut out flat section of the 1st IBC - plastic shims for levelling. Works wonders


My son came around at this time and sorted out the electricity from the pool and moved my pool timer from the shed to a waterproof enclosure box and added another weatherproof DGPO not on the timer circuit. Handy having an electrician son.


I then screwed all the framework together with batten screws and then realised that I had left the sump bladder out.
Oh well - tilt the frame up and my other son came and put the bladder in place. Job done.


Day 2 - sold my aviary - injection of funds at just the right time. Straight down the big green shed and got some plumbing fittings. Made up the top frame around two of the IBC beds and then attacked the plumbing.

Got the sump plumbing and growbeds plumbed and didn't worry about the fish tank for now. Figured I have a bit of timer before that needs to be done.

Finished just before dark and so I ran the hose into the sump and started testing. All three siphons initiated and closed off perfectly first time. I now have the pump running and with the bells removed as the pump is throttled back too much with the growbeds on flood and drain. Figured that will take the strain off the pump and let it run at its natural speed

electrical being done

Some of that timber over the ST looks a bit green, I hope it isn't treated pine!

No it's not treated pine. I have only used recycled hardwood and some of it is painted. I ran it through my table saw to bring it all to uniform size and check it's integrity. I figured the paint would Give it extra protection from weather.

Got a bir more done this weekend. Bought 1.5 tonne of gravel and then washed it and loaded it into the grow beds. Washing gravel is an absolute pain in the bottom. Anyway after several hours of this and the rear yard being waterlogged, I went and bought some seedlings and started planting. Used Rob Bobs idea of working a piece of 100mm pipe into the gravel and picking out the gravel inside the pipe, then dropping the seedling in and then lifting the pipe out and back filling the gravel.

Surprised how much fitted into 3 growbeds. Watered in with some seasol.

Today I worked on making the radial flow filter and plumbing in the SLO and back to the ST. Almost got to plumb the return line from the pump back to the FT, but was short one fitting. Oh well tomorrow another trip to the Green Shed.

Got 20 litres of aquarium water from a mate and mixed in some more seasol and then watered this into the growbeds. Hopefully it will cycle quicker and then we can add the fishies

was a bit worried about the blocks in pic 20170325_104904_resized.jpg. but see later you have that aspect all sorted out.

looking like the addiction is progressing well.
bonus is the wife looks like she is still talking to you

the real big challenge will be convincing the family that you can use that really big fish tank in the background for AP...... Colum BB even has a video for that

Hi Darren - what was the concern with the blocks? the height of the GB in relation to the tank?

The pool has been mentioned by others, but not by me. I tell them the whole yard would need to be GB's and I wouldn't have anywhere to cool off in summer

Here are some pics of the planting

>> Hi Darren - what was the concern with the blocks? the height of the GB in relation to the tank?

no just that blocks were on their ends.... but then when I saw the other photo ("Frame work set out and installed") it looked like you had sorted all that out. So I gather the frame one is a later photo even though it was in the middle ?

Yeah that was the rough setout just to get the layout and sump location, before I started digging. Had to pu them on ends to get the height roughly.

Just a quick question, how often should I be testing the water for ph, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates while I am waitkng for it to cycle? I assume this a daily thing? I am heading off on holidays next Monday for 10 days and I am worried that it might cycle while I am away and might miss it. How would I tell if it does this when I get back?

Just a quick question, how often should I be testing the water for ph, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates while I am waitkng for it to cycle? I assume this a daily thing? I am heading off on holidays next Monday for 10 days and I am worried that it might cycle while I am away and might miss it. How would I tell if it does this when I get back?

how are you cycling - ie. Have you added anything ?

what fish are you going to go with ?

knowing whether it has cycled without fish is quite easy.
Without fish you add an ammonia source and check after a few hours that there is an ammonia reading.
then check each day that the ammonia has gone through to nitrates and is not showing in nitrites.

if got fish then basically you are looking for no ammonia and no nitrites but evidence of nitrates
though..
(a) that assumes you only have a couple of fish and really should be goldfish
(b) as you only have couple fish having zero on everything is sort of OK (but not conclusive)

best bet is to keep the system ticking over while you are away - have you got someone to keep an eye on it ?
water the **grow beds** with Seasol from a watering can before you go and at day 5-6 if someone looking out for you. That will keep the plants happy and should be enough to let the nitrification to at least begin. Wont be done in 10 days regardless of method.

Darren, I did add abour 20 litres of aquarium water from a mates discus setup and I have added some seasol about 400ml at first and then about a capful a day since. I have been tipping this into 20 litres of water and then pouring this over the freshly planted plants. I have today added some fish pellets, but at this stage no fish in the system yet until it is cycled.

I was wondering about adding some cloudy ammonia as this seems to be the only type of ammonia available since the druggies/terrorists got on the scene, but was worried about this, as from what I can work out it has some sort of detergent added and "proper" ammonia solution should be clear.

Other than that I was going to add some raw prawns, possibly leaving them in the sun for a bit to make them go off a bit quicker.

Re fish I am looking at silver perch. I would like to run trout, but it may be a bit late this year by the time I have it cycled.

I have also been topping up the water in the FT today from my rain water tank as I finished the FT and RFF plumbing.

Let me know what you think is best.

Yup, cloudy ammonia has soap/detergent in it - you're correct to not use it! Seasol Powerfeed has nitrogen in it (in the form of urea and ammonia as well as nitrates, I think), or alternatively you might be able to get urea pellets from somewhere that sells fertiliser; Charlie Carp is also a good nitrogen source.

One method that a lot of people have used successfully is 'peeponics' - either collect urine and store it in a bottle until it's aged, or just pee straight into the sump/FT. You shouldn't do it if you're on any sort of medication, and some people find it gross, but it does work!

You do need to watch out for delayed ammonia production. Basically if you're using anything other than pure ammonia, a lot of the nitrogen you're adding to the system will be in the form of compounds like urea, that have to break down into ammonia before they'll show up on your tests. This means it's very very easy to add some, and a couple of days later go "huh, that's not enough" and add more (or just add way too much to start with) and then be surprised by a huge ammonia spike. Since you're cycling fishless this won't end in fishy tragedy, but if you accidentally push your ammonia levels up too high then it will actually impact your bacteria and slow the cycling down.

Thanks for that. I found a small amount of 10% ammonia solution and added that. It would have been about 5ml maximum and dissolved some urea pellets in water which would have been about a desert spoon full. Is this enough or do I need to add more?

If I need to add more urea, How much and when? I have a 5kg bag of this available, but no more ammonia solution.

I am also adding the regular season, not the power feed one about a capful a day watered in over the grow beds.

I have noooo idea of the math necessary to tell you how much urea becomes how much ammonia, but apparently the conversion takes 2-4 days; so, I'd test daily for now, and not add more until the four days are up even if you're getting low readings. Whatever level you have right now will be from the ammonia solution you added; it doesn't sound like much, but the levels we test for are parts per million. 10% in 5ml is 0.5ml, which (if I'm doing the math right) would give you one part per million in 500 litres; I'm not sure what your total water volume is, but looking back over your system I'd handwave it as somewhere over 1500 litres, so you've probably got about a 0.25ppm reading right now (unless it was old ammonia, in which case a lot might have evaporated out, see why this is very hand-wavy even if my math is right?).

Ahem. Anyway. The next several days will tell you what level of ammonia you get by putting that much urea into your size system. If you get to day 5 or 6 and it hasn't reached around 2ppm then you should be OK to add more, but I'm guessing you won't need to. If it hits levels that will inhibit the bacteria - I think it's about 6ppm where you have to start thinking about that? - you can do a partial water change to bring it down.

If you test daily while it's cycling, you'll get a full picture of how it's gone; you should get your ammonia spike, then a nitrite spike, then both should go away as your nitrates rise. This can take anywhere up to several weeks depending on your water temperature, water chemistry in general, and whether or not your bacteria are in the mood. Seriously, this is the part of setting up your aquaponics system that has everybody going "why is it taking so long? am I doing something wrong? can I speed it up?", to which the answers are "because the bacteria involved are really slow," "probably not," and "almost certainly no."

Given that you're going on holiday, you'll miss some of the cycling, but given that it takes weeks, you probably won't miss too much. In the extremely unlikely event that you come home, test your water, and get 0 ammonia 0 nitrites [some number] nitrates, it might be cycled, but it might also mean that there was only a little ammonia to start with, and the bacteria have eaten it all, but haven't grown enough. The way you check is to add enough ammonia source to bring the level up to about 1ppm, and then see how fast it goes away; if it goes back to 0 ammonia in under 24 hours without giving a nitrite spike along the way, you're fully cycled and can add (an appropriate number of) fish.

[RedCap] Since you're cycling fishless this won't end in fishy tragedy, but if you accidentally push your ammonia levels up too high then it will actually impact your bacteria and slow the cycling down.

Ammonia will also affect your plants. So you don't want it getting too high.

And having too much ammonia along with nutrients (esp. with P) would probably lead to an algae bloom.
(some systems will get algae anyway - but best not to encourage it)

As Mel notes - be very careful about adding more thinking you don't have enough and then ending up with too much. Few people have done that and it leads to problems and further delays. Go the slow conservative route. Urea based products will take some time to break down to ammonia in the first instance.

You don't really need a lot of ammonia to cycle. Just needs to be ammonia (and ultimately nitrites) present.
Provided ammonia is showing in your test kit at some level then bacteria will establish.
You can do higher doses later to check that the population can adapt to a load (which is akin to adding fish).


Re fish I am looking at silver perch. I would like to run trout, but it may be a bit late this year by the time I have it cycled.

You wouldn't be late for trout, as most people are getting them at present.
You may just have to get some larger than fingerlings.
SP would be OK as well. They just don't go so well in the cold weather. Bit of a catch 22.
In your first year, as you learn, it would probably be best to not get too many and run the system lightly stocked anyway.

*if you haven't got levels already* add your prawn heads and powerfeed, and then go away for the 10 days.
Then run tests when you get back. As long as your system is circulating over that time it will be fine.
If you have levels just water the plants like normal with Seasol before you go.

Would be worth reading Petes Thread > viewtopic.php?t=27800
That covers the process and worries that you are probably going through at the moment.
And Pete had his own Powerfeed moment early on.