Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Thanks for Darren for introducing me to dutch buckets under this thread. After reading a bit about dutch buckets, more questions:

1. Bucket fill with media of varies sort , perlite or gravels seems to be the perfected media. With media, won't it just be an individual continuous flow bed?

2. Bucket using a lid with build in mesh planter, this way, media only in that small mesh planter. Roots started with the media then suspense in air before entering water. Any particular merit in this more complex approach? More air for the roots? Do plants need to have different roots for media/air/dwc?

3. In both case, water enters on top or near the top then exit the bucket near the bottom with a upside down "U" pipe with one side of the U pointed about 1"-2" from the bucket's bottom. Wouldn't this U create some sort of siphon? That would be good, wouldn't it so less stagnant water?

How much water would be ideal? I would like to have 3"-4" of water as emergency reserve in case of power failure when I travel etc., Here in the desert, summer temp reaches 50C on hot days, wouldn't want dry out plants after a weekend away ...

5. Then the frequency of watering, continuous non stop would be easier for me, hydroponic folks seems to water only few times a day of few minutes each, more air for the roots that way?

What I wanted to do is to utilize an existing in-ground concrete pond of about 500g filled with about 10-15 fancy goldfishes. Water are currently being 'cleansed' with two 24" pots of canna lilies sitting in the pond growing vigorously. Water filtration via a homemade above ground mechanical filter with matala pads.

1. Basically yes it is a media bed but it's only a continuous flow bed if the water is always flowing.
2. Part of the merit to this is having less media but you also have less surface for biofiltration which isn't really much of a problem once the roots of the plant grow. Yes plants grow different types of roots for different conditions. This is basically DWC.
3. I'm not certain about this one but usually the upside down U has an air gap between it and the pipe it drains into so I don't believe a siphon forms.
4. As long as the water is well aerated the plant roots can be totally submerged. Some methods leave water in the bed (Constant Flood) and some drain the bed (Siphon type systems).
5. Continuous works well. There are a couple of ways you can use continuous flow, one is called Constant Flood and the other is Continuous Flow with Siphons. That's what we call them, I'm not sure what the hydro people would call them. In Constant Flood the water level in the growing container doesn't vary. When you use siphons the water level goes up and down and you need someplace for the water to be when it's not in the container (like a sump or your fish pond).

I have a style of dutch bucket and I recon they ere great

1. Basically yes it is a media bed but it's only a continuous flow bed if the water is always flowing.

+1, there are many variants. Some basically mini grow beds, some quasi DWCs and some a world on their own... some (gutter style) are almost wicking pots.


2. as Scotty says and as above... I think one of the original Bato bucket trials (originally came from hydroponics) was media less/minimal media. it is whatever you want it to be to suite your needs.

3. siphon only if you don't get air-breaks. You do have to allow for it - as with all AP.
keeping everything tight with fittings can cause issues.
Using a T instead of an elbow works else just drill a couple of holes in the pipe just inside the bucket.
Air intake = no siphon.

"How much water would be ideal?" usually go for about 1/3 water (immersed media and/or voids) and remaining 2/3 wet media. But could be as much as 1/2 - 1/2 or even a higher flood then drain if you used rock media for example.
Less depth OK if your media wicks since roots get moist water (eg. clay etc)
Mainly you want depth of bucket (ie. 300-500mm) and then 100-200mm water.

4. As long as the water is well aerated the plant roots can be totally submerged, but it is much easier to just have an air gap. Even in a DWC the presence of an air gap can reduce the need for additional aeration.

Some methods leave water in the bucket others use a high and low level (like any Flood & Drain).
You can also trickle feed a bucket system as long as the media stays moist to wet.
Caveat - avoid small pipes - they block really easily....esp. if water not filtered.

Kratky DWC for example works on air gap alone and plants develop water and 'air' roots.
Keeping your your DO up is a bonus but you get enough from circulation flow alone in most cases.
You dont need airstones. The classic Kratky lettuce in a juice bottle showed you can grow in a non-circulating environment. Plants definitely can get by with less circulation - much of AP circulation benefits the fish.

5. Continuous works well....and any other combination. My preference is to always have around 100mm of water in the bucket. Beyond that you can do it as much or as little as you like. I think F&F's one (Food&Fish) only goes once or couple times a day

re: drying - some of the hydroponic ones leave the lids on. So if you are worried about drying that would serve to maintain rootzone humidity.


Top feed in and bottom out is easy and ensures some circulation.
But various people use bottom feed and drain.


>> @F&F I have a style of dutch bucket and I recon they are great

+1 pretty much sums it up. My best tomatoes come from the buckets not the grow beds.
And within reason I can do a lot more to/with them.

Thanks guys, I think I will go like this:

1. media filled buckets with pelites and Lid on; seems to be easier than the lid with mesh planter idea.
2. continuous flow and keeping 1/3 of bucket fill with water.
3. hydroponic people use 1/4" tubes, but that would be easy to clog wouldn't it? If I use 1/2" pvc pipe to feed water, will that be too much water?

Media buckets with lids on sounds like a plan. You dont say how big - 5 Gal or something like that ?

1/4" from a pond would be a risk. Even 1/2" (12-13mm) blocks pretty easily unless filtered.
My pref is 15mm PVC rather than poly pipe as PVC has external fittings while poly fittings go inside.
(not sure what 15mm is in US sizes). If going black poly I would think about 19-20mm main feed lines.
Guess thats 3/4". Small irrigation type fittings don't go too well with 'organic' water

Not sure on the perlite. Coming from a pond you may find that clay media or even coarse gravel is better option.
You are likely to get quite a bit of organic matter building up in the buckets. At 1/3 full that may be issue for the roots - but I have no experience with perlite

The other question is what type of pump and flow rate are you looking at ?

I am thinking of using 5g buckets from homedepot, they are US$2.5 per so cheap. They are also about 18"tall, so bottom 1/3 for water would be 6". Do you think that's too much water?

I am planning to place them at ground level next to the pond, then build some sort of raised bed around them so they would have soil around them, mostly for summer insulation so water and roots won't be cooked. Think it's necessary?

This the pond setup
1. It was a former in-ground octagon spa, about 6ft wide and 5 ft deep,
2. about 10 ft away from the spa is a separate inground mechanical area about 6'x6' and about 7' deep.
3. pump is placed in the mechanical area, 3ft above from the floor or 4ft below spa's water level.
4. Water pump to enter from the bottom of an above ground 2.5ft tall mechanical filter with matala filter pads.
5. From the top of the mechanical filter, water piped to some kind of waterfall structure that is 2ft tall, then waterfall back to the pond.



This is my pump:
http://waterwayplastics.com/products/sp ... n-might-2/

I reckon with the head and multiple 90deg elbows, I am getting around 20-25gpm. or 2 turnover of water per hour.

I'd be afraid to even use 1/2" hose if I were to feed from the top. I may add more Dutch buckets to my current expansion, but I would bottom feed with 2" tube and a 1" bell siphon. The reason for 2" tube instead of my current 1" is to be absolutely sure that all buckets are draining before the siphon breaks. But right now with being fed (And drained) from the side via a 1" tube, I've had no problems.

I'm not sure about the Home Depot plastic buckets but the blue colored Lowes buckets become brittle within a year or two of sitting in the sun (this was my experience with the Lowes buckets). Food grade buckets seem to hold up much better and would be a better choice anyway.

I buy the black buckets at the factory for like $2.50 a pop. The company is called Fortiflex. I'm pretty sure they have in the States, but not sure if in all of the states.

I, see this mis-information all the time on whether food grade buckets will hold up better.

It doesn't have anything to do with being food grade. These are utility buckets, designed for interior storage, they weren't designed for planters sitting in the sun.

If you want a bucket that will hold up to the suns rays, then you need a bucket that has UV stabilizers added to the plasticizers before molding. Expect to pay 3-6 times the price as food grade.

Now on to what is Food Grade plastics.

Plastics that come in contact with your food or drink ‘should’ be safe based on the following general information. Look for the Recycle symbol (often on the bottom of the container) and read the number located inside the symbol.

The following list cross-references the recycle number (recycling symbol) with what is generally considered safe for food (or not safe).

Plastics Generally Considered Safe for Food and Drink
#2 HDPE (high density polyethylene) Lowes and Home Depot buckets.
#4 LDPE (low density polyethylene)
#5 PP (polypropylene)

Plastic Water Bottle or Soft Drink Container
Nalgene Tritan Wide Mouth BPA-Free Water Bottle

#1 PETE (polyethylene terephthalate) typical water, soda, and juice bottles, not designed for reuse or storage due to the possibility of bacterial buildup, be sure to properly clean them if reusing.


Risky Plastics Not Safe for Food and Drink

These may leach or have hazardous ingredients.

#3 PVC (polyvinyl chloride) carcinogens during manufacture and incineration
#6 PS (polystyrene) possible carcinogen
#7 other (usually polycarbonate, sometimes labeled PC) may leach BPA (Bisphenol-A)

Oh, forgot to mention how you can get a food grade bucket to stand up to the sun better.

1. Scratch the outside of the bucket with sandpaper to roughen the surface.
2. Using a Flat Black Acrylic paint, paint the bucket, this will block sunlight from entering the bucket.
3. Then paint the bucket a lighter color, I prefer Flat White Acrylic paint, this will reflect the sunlight.

The following is a 5 gal, Lowes bucket before painting, 1.5 gal water reservoir in the bottom, used to plant 7 herbs or strawberry plants, or 1 Tomato and 4 Herb plants in the vertical face planting holes.





These are single use buckets that were sold to individuals at Trade Shows, or Farmers Markets. They could either buy the buckets and plant themselves or I would plant them with Herbs for them.

They were give Care Instructions, and part of those instructions included using Aquarium exchange water instead of a dry or liquid fertilizer. Any of them that used the fish water would always tell me how much better growth they got.

These planters can be hooked up "Daisy Chained" together using 1/2" PVC fittings and ABS Irrigation fittings, with 1" black vinyl tubing between them, painted Flat white.

Now you will also want to keep the water reservoirs full, 24/7/365 days. This was done using another 5 gal bucket with a Horizontal Float valve and the fittings described above. Add a PVC water hose connection to the float, and hook to a faucet, turn on half to full turn and your set.

For customers that wanted to use exchange water from their AP system's, get a 55 gal barrel, strain the water to 1-200 microns, and hook the barrel straight to the float valve.

The white polyester cord in the middle of the bucket would lift the water up into the soil media, and you know the "rest of the story"

25 gal Re-Cycled SIP Molasses container with 8 Vertical face planting holes.

The Fortiflex products are used by the Equine trade "Hay Burners" They do have UV stabilizers added to their products since they know that these buckets will be out in the sun.

Now whether they are "Food Grade" you need to ask them or look on the bottom of the buckets.

I, don't know that answer since I don't raise or own "Hay Burners"

Tractor Supply handles Fortiflex products.

Thanks Old Prospector for you input, not sure if I am getting it right. This is how I understand your setup:

1. Big holes on the side of your painted buckets are for planting.
2. At the bottom of bucket is the water reservoir, which must be kept full 24x7x365.
3. A pipe, looks like 3/4" or 1" connects the water reservoir to the top of the bucket.
4. You are using a foam to separate the water reservoir from the planting media?
5. 2 polyester cords raise water from the reservoir to the planting area.
6. Looks like water enters the bucket for the plants but water do not exit the bucket? Unless the smaller holes are basically overflow protection.
7. Wouldn't this be more similar to wicking bed? Although online drawings of wicking bed do now show the use of a foam to separate the reservoir from the media.
8. What kind of media do you use? soil?

1. Big holes on the side of your painted buckets are for planting.
Yes, 2.25" diameter, so a 4" potted plant can be planted from the inside out. But there is a pc of 4mm Coroplast that is used for a key around the plants stem or a crown to hold everything inside the bucket. This also is used so you never plant a crown deeper than needed.

2. At the bottom of bucket is the water reservoir, which must be kept full 24x7x365.
If Daisy Chained together on a level surface. But unlevel surfaces can be 3" in 50', or a 6" deep reservoir 5" in 50'.


3. A pipe, looks like 3/4" or 1" connects the water reservoir to the top of the bucket.
3/4" used for filling for single buckets, but also the design for Daisy Chained also has the same fill tube. Murphy's Law.
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4. You are using a foam to separate the water reservoir from the planting media?
No its a signage material, 10mm Coroplast[/size].

5. 2 polyester cords raise water from the reservoir to the planting area.
Those are 3/8" diameter, usually use a single 5/8" dia., You can buy it at any fabric store, its called "Piping Cord" just make sure its Polyester, they also make it from Cotton, but cotton will rot in water. But I ran out of this cord and have started using Polyester Microfiber towels, they lift water faster and higher than regular Polyester cord

6a. Looks like water enters the bucket for the plants but water do not exit the bucket?
It can be done both ways, depends how you design the fittings.

6b. Unless the smaller holes are basically overflow protection.
Those holes are 7/8" drain holes for rainwater from the media used

7a. Wouldn't this be more similar to wicking bed?
Similar, but is based on "Wick Hydroponic" system designs.


7b. Although online drawings of wicking bed do now show the use of a foam to separate the reservoir from the media.
Newer saw that design using foam. I've always have used 10mm Coroplast, or 4mm in a pinch. I get mine from a signage company for Free.

8. What kind of media do you use? soil?
Soil-Less always. Peat/Bark mix, straight Perlite, tallings from a plastic fabricator, Shredded foams, plastic beads, glass beads, etc.
But really you don't need any of the above, all you need is the Wick.

Anything else, just ask.