Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Gunagulla, I guess that was a part of my thought that I did not clearly state. In the discussed configuration, the shed may help contain the cooled air, thereby limiting the ambient heat gain as well.
I'm certainly with you on the use of insulation, as I said my concern is normally heat loss, I wish I needed to worry about too much heat.

Gunagulla and Gingerbread Man
Thanks so much for the advice how to insulate and make use of the geothermal advantages of buying the ST's somewhat.
I am so envious of your water temp ranges Gunagulla and now can see the advantages of burying the FT and ST's.

My concern after reading about burying IBC ST's is the earth caving in and crushing the IBC if buried without the cage and some sort of wall material around the IBC to protect it? I have a roll of geotextile I was early thinking of wrapping around the IBC cages. Also I have seen on other AP projects on here the ground water lifting the IBC out of the hole as water collected around it. My other concern was the stagnant water collecting around the buried IBC becoming a breeding ground for mozzies.
My initial thoughts were to bury 3 x IBC's joined together with uni-seals contained in their cage with sides wrapped in geotextile.
But now can understand how some burying of the IBC can still aid the temps with geothermal help. And not be such an issue refilling if having to move in the future and back fill.

Avoiding council approval by keeping within requirements is my main concern as well. 3m(H) x 20m2(AREA) is the maximum I have to keep within to erect any GH or pergola.

My initial thoughts of using the shed were to prevent issues with birds, cats and curious children. I am now thinking of how I will cover the FT and the ST's??

Most of my GB design will be around whether I go with the GH or pergola???

Thank you Porter for this advice and new direction I haven't considered. CF I can see would benefit alot in my design and I would appreciate if you could sketch it up for me. My concern is understanding how CF affects plant growth compared with F&D and understanding how effective the water is exchanged between GB's?
My understanding also with F&D is that there is mostly a complete emptying of the GB's promoting oxygen into the GB and full turning over of the water in the GB.
Would I experience problems with anaerobic areas and a depletion in bacteria compared with F&D?
It does sound a great answer to my ST worries and more cost effective :-) definitely an idea I need to look into.

In design 2 - why don't you make an tap release or screwcap on lowest part of the pipe the 90 (which would become a T) before the GB so you can clean any muck that accumulates.

Scoria has worked for me - more surface area and I put white river pebbles on the top 1/3 - easy to plant and looks nice.

The 90mm pipe feeding growbeds really only needs a very slight angle. - how are you going to T off into GB's? I used 90to50 reducers that you can twist (the 50mm part is offset) to adjust flow.

Dangus, when I discuss burying the tank, I mean bury and backfill, for thermal coupling. This must be done carefully sometimes, depending on soil, but just like a swimming pool, need not be a problem. As long as the tank (or pool) remains full, no problem. if the tank is empty, then it can float out or collapse inwards, but in both cases this depends on soil type and moisture levels. Also, all of this can basically be ignored if you are only partially burying, say no more than 30cm. For the partial depth I have suggested, I'd bury tank and frame, and backfill to the tank. This would be easiest with sand or sandy soil, so as to fill in between the frame and tank and around the bars.

As can be seen in the pics early in my system thread, my tanks are buried in soil with a high clay content, the sides are reasonably stable, I partially filled with water then filled the gap between tank and clay with a mix of sand and clay.

Thanks, I haven't purchased any piping yet or fully considered what I need until I get this design right, but will definitely use your idea of the "T" with cap at lowest point.

I was thinking either 90mm or 100mm pipe depending on price with 50mm reducers as you suggest.

I was thinking blue metal but now think I will do same as you scoria and white river pebbles.
How do u go when removing plants and then bringing up scoria with roots and then mixing them together?
My thoughts of maybe some sort of cylinder or box to put around the plant before removing may make it possible to then add back the scoria then the pebbles?

Thanks that now clears that question up that I can also bury the cage and backfill.

Hi Dangus,

Firstly, two disclaimers,
1. I am only beginning my foray into CF, and the rebuild of our little system WILL be built on the theory i have used here, so i am not giving you anything i wouldn't use myself.

2. I have never used a SLO and only speculating on its performance and efficiency, at this level, there are others that have that nailed better then me.


Ok, i HOPE that the details are clear, 800x600 is a small picture really, i can always email you bigger ones if your still interested, but that is neither here nor there.

My suggestions are as follows:

Placing the pump in a balancing tank means it is working at its most efficient because there is no lose due to head height or distance. I am doing exactly this in my new system. I suggest a minimum of 4500ltr per hour pump because of the huge volume of water your going to move around.
Also that kind of current can only improve the SLO capabilities.

Use full uncut IBC's as sumps, and plump the water return into the taps at the bottom of the IBC with a Jenco or something. I use them on my little system and they are great.

Use no smaller than 40mm pipe for your stand pipes and water delivery and a minimum of 100mm on the water return pipes.

The balancing tank is just that, a barrel like a blue barrel to house the pump and deliver water to the fish tank.

Finally, because i have already felt i have preached to much choose the pump for this system with a lot of care, the very very best you can afford.

Regards to you,

Just started fully reading your wonderful thread, I was concerned that backfilling around the ST's may cause in times of saturation the surrounding earth to push the walls of the IBC in.
I thought best to not bury the IBC base, just the outer cage to aid thermal coupling and aid more depth to the IBC buried.
My thoughts were to wrap the geotextile around the IBC cage then backfill between the cage and IBC and then backfill from the geotextile to the dirt wall. Thus still enabling the thermal coupling but preventing a cave-in.
Also maybe using plastic and crush-a-dust under the pavers will aid in preventing water saturating that area around the ST's.

Sorry, forgot this part,
I am learning CF myself, however it is a proven method of growing by members here, and i am only clinging to the shoulders of others here.

The 30m air gap allows the plants roots to gain the oxygen they need and prevents a plant from drowning, as well as the water they require from the source below. Think something along the lines of a natural water table.

From what i have studied from the others using CF here, you will have no worries.
I removed all my siphons a few months ago and went to CF with no lose of plant growth or issues.

So again, no advice offered that i haven't or wouldn't do myself.

So far i have experience no issues with anaerobic areas or depletion in bacteria, and RobBob (i think) has a beaut youtube clip on how to address areas like that if they occur.

Regards

The area around my buried tanks has been completely saturated a number of times after heavy rainfalls, but the internal pressure from the contained water, and strength of the tanks, means I've had no problems. I suspect IBCs are a lot weaker structurally, so you should so some additional strengthening, just to be safe. If it only the bottom 30cm or so buried, I can't see any problems arising, so long as there is water in the IBC.

Wow!! Please "PREACH" as much as you want lol, thanks so much for taking the time to do us a diagram layout, I find it easier to visualize an idea then read it , I now can see that's the best direction for me which will enable me to partially bury my IBC's say 300mm-400mm, which wont cause a prob if i later have to remove and backfill.
After setting my GB's up on 2 x Besser blocks and sleepers that will give me plenty of height to flow 100mm pipe back to ST's.

Would I be better off just using 3xIBC's in a row as ST's?
Are you suggesting I use the Jenco's to connect piping from the IBC water outlets and not use uni-seals?

Can you recommend any pumps?

My last and biggest decision now is the expense of the either the
Sproutwell 6mm 'Prestige' 6000 Model Greenhouse 6.25m x 3m supported by bessa blocks or or the pergola such as in Faye's System viewtopic.php?f=18&t=1622&p=477887&hilit=fayes+system#p477887 ??????

I can see now I have alot more reading to do lol

Scoria does mix a little - but you just shake and lift the plants and its pretty good.

I have 1/2 sumps connected in a row with 90mm uniseals and pipe - saves digging - make sure you put the uniseal join down low.

At the end of the beds I have the sump offset so I can access the pump.

See my school system here:

In this design I cut IBC's from top to bottom vertically for the GB's and the other way for the Sumps



If you use uniseals - make slits about 2" + long and using a 5mm grinding blade - add heaps of detergent or oil. Also you will need to brace the sump wall with some wood cut to length on each side or the seal so the bladder doesn't collapse - do the sumps before the growbeds have rocks !

My Pleasure, no worries at all.
Do you mean three IBC's as 2 sump tanks and a balancing tank? sure, no problems, the only thing to keep in mind there is, that it is 1000 more litres to move round as opposed to just 200(ish).
And if NSW is anything like VIC, then you may have to consider a limit for producing water on a residential property. For VIC, that is 10,000Ltrs, above that your require a permit.

Regarding the Uniseal v Jenco, if you plumb the water return via a jenko into the bottom of the IBC's standard valve, then you have the opportunity to close the sumps from the rest of the system for maintainace on the beds or emergencies etc, that's really all.
Being so large, there is a real need to be able to isolate the sections of to work on it, expand it etc.
Such as the ability to switch the beds off completely and still circulate the fist tank.

I love Sproutwell, i used to have a 4.2m version for my first system, IceManDude has one too as does his parents enormous one. Actually check that out, it is raised up as you describe, worth the look.

I am not sure in regards to a suitable pump, i have never gone that large, sorry mate.

Also, (taking advantage of your permission to preach ) your making a huge investment in this system, so investing in infrastructure is worth it. Bunnings has refrigeration panel type thick foam sheets that you can enclose, then clad your tanks, GB's and sumps in to reduce heat exposure also.
This is something we will be exploring ourselves with this new DWC we are building.

I can't remember for the life of me who it was, but there is precedent for that idea here on the forum.

ok, i promise to be quiet now!!

Best of luck to you, I look forward to your build,

Regards