Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

And... just saying... I merely mention 9/11 and a normally quite sensible person suddenly is 'lost' and nobody else has bothered posting on the original topic. Suddenly the ability to think becomes a 'conspiracy theory' and now the use of cures or therapies that might actually help people has been relegated.

I did try to make it clear how the same mental processes are being used to manipulate both our health and our world view, but hey, ignoring physics is apparently the new black. Physics is not hard. There are laws. When they are broken it is obvious.

9/11 makes obvious that most people have zero knowledge of the laws of physics. And THAT is a program that began in Prussia.

It isn't difficult to trace the paths... and the food and medicine and palliative care are all found as signs along the paths. None of these things are isolated even though the MS M would like you to believe they are. And it is not actually hard to make the links if one stops eating Maccas and watching all the News that is News and actually tries to work out what you are being fed.

Iraq, Iran, Libya, Syria... common factors? hm... none of them have World Bank Debt... Strange... don't you think? Could there be an issue with The Fed wanting to subjugate the countries the European Banks cannot control?

Google Titanic, Jesuits, The Fed and ponder how we came to this world.

Drunk I might be, stupid...? Never.

Journeyman, I happen to hold a similar view to you concerning the facts relating to the destruction of the World Trade Centre and the attack on the Pentagon (I refuse to refer to these particular events by the popular month/day descriptor used by others - a foible of mine).

Yavimaya seems to not agree with some or all of your theories and said, 'When you start talking like that people are not likely to want to play with you.' Ironically, I do agree with much of what you say but I am not overly inclined to play with you either. People generally don't appreciate the views of others if they feel that those views are being shoved down their throat. I'm sorry to say that there is a certain amount of 'throat shoving' implied in your words.

As far as I can see the plane just flew into the tower, so what would be hard about that ?

Fair call. It's a failing of mine I guess.

I think it is a response to the overwhelming falseness of the official view tyhat is upheld by so many people who wish not to believe any US officials could perpetrate such an horrific act upon the people they are meant to be serving. After years of having people staunchly deny facts right in front of them in order to stay safe in their delusions, I guess I developed a rhetoric that comes across as more dogmatic than it need be.

At every turn there is obfuscation and outright lies about the events of that day, and a lot of work has been done by some very determined people to cover over any hint the official story by be just that, a made up story.

At every point of the story there are questions to be answered, from the eerie parallel between the events and part of the Vigilant Guardian exercise being run, through to the missing gold stockpile known to be under the towers and even the extreme urgency in getting rid of the debris and shipping it off overseas to be 'recycled' is another hint that something is wrong.

@mantis - flying planes into buildings might seem a relatively easy thing to do, but when the plane is the size of those used on 9/11, it isn't at all easy to do.

Add to that the flight paths show maneuvers which highly experienced pilots and the flight characteristics data for those planes both say would stress the planes way past the design safety limits and something begins to smell.

Plus, in spite of official claims that the buildings were vulnerable to such a weapon, they were instead specifically designed to NOT collapse from a 600mph collision with a Boeing 707 or DC-8 type of jet. Some quotes from the design investigations in the 60's...

In addition there is the plane at the Pentagon ignoring some basics rules of physics to hit the ground floor of the building - an almost impossible feat BTW, due to the "cushion" ground effect of air when flying that close to the ground, and making a 16ft hole and failing to leave the distinctly not flammable and quite solid engines anywhere in or out of the Pentagon.

A plane that strangely appears on no video footage from what would have to be one of the most secure buildings on the planet.

http://pilotsfor911truth.org has many professional pilots trying to make sense of not only the official story, but the discrepancies in reports, animations and flight data released to explain what happened.

I am all for going back to the original topic. Keep in mind, some of us are still healing from that event. When people bring it up, it makes those wounds harder to heal. It is bad enough that the intel said that it was preventable, and that our leaders did not act on the intel. It just seems like bad enough is not enough to some people. It was an outrage no matter what. If it was truly planned, we would not have has so many firefighters and police die. A planned disaster from history would be Seattle's great fire. The whole city burned down, and there was not a single casualty. Now I am not saying we should not question our government, my short time with Amnesty International opened my eyes to that. The thing is that those events were heavily scrutinized. There was not a media outlet in the world that was not trying to make sense of it. Am I outraged at how my government used the tragedy to start wars, and create policies that are unconstitutional? Hell yes! But I think the "official line" as you call it has met quite a bit of scrutiny, and has held up.

Back on to alternative cures!

To me, there is a connection across all these various and nefarious 'theories' about how we are being treated by those who are supposed to be serving the People. For example, the fear game they play - it used to be the USSR or the Yellow Peril, but now they have a self-perpetuating fear game called 'The War On Terror' or TWOT. Not only is it a war they can never win, it creates many more new 'terrorists' every time a bomb is dropped or a bullet fired or even a sanction is applied.

But TWOT has several purposes, or rather fear does. Fear makes us predictable by turning us into black & white thinkers. The 'you are either with us or against us' sounds rational if you are scared but in a more calm environment it can be seen for the BS it really is.

But that same fight or flight also shuts down the viscera; (the organs and systems making us healthy and producing energy etc) it makes no sense to be wasting body resources digesting the sandwich you just had when the lion is leaping at you. All resources go to the fight/flight reflex and the more positive areas of the body go without until the danger is past.

And with TWOT, the danger is never past - it can be ramped up as soon as a politician wants to distract us from the new gifts he is about to give the banks, or to goad us into a course of action.

And chief among the positive aspects of the viscera, is the immune system. So, by promoting Swine flu as an epidemic, they can actually make it MORE likely people will get sick, because the fear spread by the MSM (MainStream Media) will reduce the immune response because of increased stress.

Add in the decrease in the value of foods once touted as healthy, because of over-cropping and the rather naive view we can strip out all the nutrients from soil and just replace the ones WE think are important and we have reduced capacity by the body to respond to stress.

Add in still more - the increase of chemicals in our foods has mostly unknown effects - instead of requiring an additive has a positive and proven effect on us before it is allowed into foods, we simply require the manufacturer to provide evidence that they tested it and found no or minor harm. Why anyone would think it sane to let the profit-seekers test their own goods is beyond me, but that's the system now. Monsanto, as an example, has even been made immune to prosecution if things go wrong, so Indian farmers are unable to get compensation for their losses.

Big Pharma has no interest in cures, not only because of their profit-taking at the expense of human lives, but because cures would reduce the stress felt by the general population. That is why the discoveries of cancer cures are suppressed and the people involved vilified. Cancer is a wonderful tool for them - apparently random in where and when it strikes, usually so delayed in appearance the corporate poisons can't be directly identified as connected, it is a great source of stress for almost everyone.

Across the board of almost every conspiracy theory I have heard there is an underlying connection - profit. Sitting like obese spiders in the centre of their webs we have the 0.01%, the ultra rich, making decisions with OUR lives that lead only to them getting more and more power and money.

Long derided as Conspiracy nonsense, the idea that the 0.1% or even more, the 0.01% might control the world has been given a factual base. New Scientist published research showing how the lines of control of the TransNational Corporations (TNC's) lead to a very small group of controllers.

From Orbis 2007, a database listing 37 million companies and investors worldwide, they pulled out all 43,060 TNCs and the share ownerships linking them. Then they constructed a model of which companies controlled others through shareholding networks, coupled with each company's operating revenues, to map the structure of economic power.


The red dots are the 147 super-controllers out of the 1300 or so that have interlocking ownership across the 43,000 TNC's.

To my view, while we sit and look at all the things going on as single events, we miss the big picture, which can be seen as, this world is NOT being run for our benefit nor are almost any of the 'news' stories we are fed even attempting to be true. Only by looking for the common connections between the various issues and problems we are having will we be able to see who is doing what to us.

And to be honest, it doesn't take a lot of looking before you begin to see family names recurring in different areas.

It also helps to have a healthy suspicion of the real meaning behind things promoted as good for us. For example, FOI legislation around the world was touted as Govts being accountable, but the truth is radically different. Govts NEVER had the right to withhold information from citizens; FOI enshrined into law that right. We could have taken any Govt to court (in so-called democracies anyway) and the law would have forced the Govt to show us the information. Now they have the right to withhold anything they feel like for 30 years, or longer if they decide to, and FOI requests are rarely met without heavy redaction of the content.

Promoting a pretty innocuous flu as a major threat to health might seem a strange thing to do, even with the view of it increasing our predictability or concealing a more dastardly activity, but add in Rumsfled's connection to multi-millions of doses of Tamiflu on the verge of going past their use-by date and we see a direct link to the profit-taking activity.

So, in my view, 9/11 IS relevant to the discussion of alternative cures and processes we might find here; it is one of the symptoms of a sick bunch of people who care not in the slightest for your or my health and who will kill or sacrifice anyone on the altar of their greed.

'nuff said...

I agree that the war on terror is a load of crock and only used to direct folks attentions away from anything else. I don't think the US gov knows how to do anything else now but start wars on terror as they are so indebted to it. If they spent the money they spend on war on infrastructure and the good of the people then the US truly would be great. But this will not happen
I think the reaction to bird/swine flu outbreaks is just over reaction and panic and nothing else
I think everyone knows my thoughts on Monsanto and other companies of their ilk, and if the us wants to use up their cruise missiles these US companies would be better terrorist targets

TWOT had a different meaning when I went to school....

Still has much the same meaning...

but different spelling.

My knowledge of metallurgy has become rather rusty over the years.

6000 F is 3315 Celsius

Jet engines are made of :

titanium
melting point=1668 C
boiling point = 3287 C

Nickel superalloy
melting point= 1350 C

Since the internal temperatures of the operating engine is 2100 Celsius in the combustor

and 1600 Celsius in the turbine, my question is?


How do they test these engines to 6000 F and why??

cheers Lou

Oh dear, I do find these discussions rather strange... So there's a very small percentage of the worlds population that are really really rich... Yep, couldn't really have everyone being incredibly rich, there's only so much to go around.. Oh, and those uber rich people tend to control most large corporations? Well, your not going to find a grano worker controlling a giant multinational.. And they tend to be a few main families? Well money and power does tend to get inherited, and passed down to relatives, and shared around amongst the rellies.

The world is NOT being run for your average plebs benefit, but rather for the benefit of the super wealthy? Well I guess that's because they have all the money and control the mega corporations, that's what you'd expect isn't it... Doesn't anyone with any power and wealth try to make others and/or the system work for their benefit? And this is on all levels, not just the uber wealthy and powerful.

The war on terror? Well yeah, how else do these rich people make money, there's lots of money to be made from war..

Big Pharma doesn't cure people? Of course not, why would any business want to get rid of it's own market..

News stories not even attempting to be true? Real news doesn't make money...

What I don't understand is why people think that the world is here to serve them and do the right thing by them? Our society is ruled by greed, why would the world be run for the benefit of the average pleb, who is going to do that?

But it's not some big Ohhh Ahhh conspiracy... It's just how things are in a consumer society, the consumer doesn't rule, they are a slave to the supplier.

My bad Lou - I misremembered the figures rather than looking them up. The 6000 was the gallons of fuel.

The point still stands though - where are the engines? That little fire could not possibly have vaporised them nor the usual debris found after plane crashes, plus first responders report no sign of a plane hitting the building and the only released photos show one frame only of an indistinct something that could not possibly be a large 757, particularly when compared to the background trees.

@Joel - a conspiracy is just 2 or more people getting together to secretly make things happen. If the ultra-rich connive and collude to make sure they get richer, that is, by definition, a conspiracy. To commit murder and destroy lives in so doing makes it criminal conspiracy.

Just because greed is programmed into us constantly doesn't make it either right or a good way to live. By shrugging off what is happening as somehow a normal part of life we condone such actions and blind ourselves to the fact it should not be happening.

We are told we live in Democratic systems, so tiny groups should not be allowed to run their programs using us all as victims and/or stooges. If we don't look and see what is happening we remain as victims to be shoved around the board as dictates of greed and selfish motives require.

So lets all get on the internet and complain bitterly about it...?


I choose not to let such things effect me, or rather effect me as little as possible, and to work outside of such things wherever possible...

Different strokes I guess. I don't see it as complaining bitterly but rather as an attempt to show others how I see things; as pointed out above, I often have a problem with the choice of phrase and some people get their backs up about it. But they have to read what I wrote before they can get annoyed so maybe something will click at some point when they get fed the BS that passes for news.

This thread began with an attempt to bring some change; talking about it also might help others to see the con being run on them. It's a certainty they will not learn anything about it from the MSM.

There are things we can all do such as stop paying the bastards. Whenever possible, buy from locals, shop in the stores not the supermarkets, put your money back into the community rather than the corporations. Also stop using credit and pay off the debt you have. Save to buy things, not go into debt.

Also look around for opportunities to help others - offer a mint to the person on the train with the annoying cough. Help that pregnant woman at the checkout. Pass over the unexpired parking ticket to someone just parking.