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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 18th, '13, 02:42 
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We will certainly look into incorporating the cistern if we think about expanding. For the moment I 've decided not to use it. It has exciting possibilities, must be said.

I've started improvised fishless cycling (with ammonium from the shop) a few days ago. I seeded a large perforated bucket of expanded clay with a handfull of lava grit from our pond and the temperatures have been summery. I have been running the pump a few times a day. Is it possible that I am already getting nitrate readings? My test says so...

Today I got river pebbles from the garden centre and I have started cleaning the pebbles and filling the growbed. I've spread the expanded clay through the pebbles hoping to seed any bacteria around to the new pebbles. For today I am done, as my back is already protesting after doing 5 bags of 15 kg. What can I say.... Wimpy girl muscles.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 18th, '13, 13:02 
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After we moved 700L of gravel from trailer to the growbed some 20m and up 4 steps it's plain to see why the professionals only use the expanded clay balls in their systems!

but the gravel only cost $40 as opposed to the $500 for the same volume of expanded clay.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 18th, '13, 13:29 
That's $460 worth of alcohol.. to soothe any aches and pains... :D


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 21st, '13, 05:58 
Seriously, this cant be healthy.
Seriously, this cant be healthy.
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Trick is to
1- set up your washing station so that you are NOT bending over at all while you wash. It is not the washing or lifting that causes the back to ach, it is the bending over that will do you in.
2- use small buckets and baskets to move the gravel. Whimpy girl muscles can actually do a heck of a lot more than you might expect if you to lighter weights and more repetitions. I really like the small (perhaps 2 gallon) buckets for moving the gravel and I will usually use only about half the bucket of gravel per plant basket to swish in the bins of water.
3- If you can set up the washing station near the grow beds, then you use small buckets to move an amount of gravel over to your washing station and then you spend a little time washing that amount of gravel and once washed you can dump it directly into the beds.

You can often pick up the little buckets free from a bakery as they often hold frosting.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 21st, '13, 21:29 
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Yes, the second day I had my husband empty the bags in the wheelbarrow. I took it from there, in small batches, just like you say.

All gravel now washed and in the growbed, but it isn't enough. Can't believe how much pebbles that growbed is 'eating'. I've planted the tomatoes that I had rooted in vermiculite (break off a piece of plant from where you pinch out the plant anyway and stick in vermiculite; wait for a week and you have root growth). Anyway, tomatoes dont't mind being earthed up (pebbled up?) later so I went ahead and planted them as they were outgrowing their pots.

The FT isn't plumbed in yet, so I am now cycling from the ST to the GB and back. The timer is set to 15 min pumping, it takes about 3 min to fill, and it takes about 10-15 min to drain. Filling will be slower than this, I guess, when it is being gravity filled from the FT rather than pumped.

I've dosed the system with a few ml of ammonia (-um?) a few times and today I added a cap full of seaweed extract.

I am working on the FT. Installed the bulkhead fitting for the SLO yesterday. There is a lot more to be done, but at least the system has started the process of cycling while the temps are high.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 25th, '13, 20:08 
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Yeah, we got nitrites and nitrates!

I have been dosing the system, which currently has approx 350 liters, with a few ml of ammonium every few days and now I suddenly have coloured patches on my test strip.

What strikes me as strange is how it is balanced. There seem to be many more nitrates (100 mg/l) than nitrites (10 mg/l).

Unfortunately my strip doesn't test for ammonia. Before I get fish, I will have to buy a test for that.

Anyway, the system will be dilluted by another 1000 l as soon as I get the FT plumbed in. Any day now...


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 26th, '13, 18:04 
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Yay! First trial of full system circulation is (mostly) successful. The fT overflow works well enough to keep up with the pump. And this despite multiple curves, a fairly long distance from FT to GB and the water needing to go back up to the GB just 20-30 cm lower than the exit from the FT.

All my pvc connections are slightly leaky, though. So I set all back to my previous circulation and will ask dear husband if he can help with the pvc. Still happy with the progress, though!


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 26th, '13, 18:52 
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looks like its coming together nicely Janna.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 26th, '13, 20:55 
Seriously, this cant be healthy.
Seriously, this cant be healthy.
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Leaky pvc that you want to be able to take apart later, you can add a bit of silicone aquarium sealant and put back together, the seal isn't perm but should stop any leaks. Or you can use PVC cement where you want the connections to be perm. Now if there is a connection that you are worried about getting knocked apart but you want to be able to take it apart for some reason, you can do the silicone trick and add a tiny stainless steel screw to hold the pipes together so they can't accidentally get knocked apart.

If your Nitrite is High, stop dosing the ammonia until the nitrite comes down to below 1 ppm. Get a complete test kit, the test tube and dropper type test kits are more accurate than test strips.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 27th, '13, 01:38 
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Agreed, get yourself an API Master Freshwater Test Kit at any aquarium supply store.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 27th, '13, 13:38 
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Thanks for the tips, all. For now I will get a NH3/4 test separately, until I have used up the strips. I don't believe they sell the test kit you all seem to have here, but something similar is certainly available.

I will do a partial water change today to dilute. It will run through the system and hopefully by tonight it will have been well mixed and oxigenated.

You see: Unexpectedly I am going to get fish today! After researching I decided on grass carp and i found a supplier online. Now that my system is developing I figured to call this supplier, seeing to discuss delivery of some grass carp in a few weeks. Turns out he doesn't have them. I had already asked around for local suppliers but 'caught' nothing. Or very expensive. Today we are traveling for a family visit and the one of the other suppliers I found on the net is fairly close by where we are going. They can set up the fish with a styrofoam box and a bag of oxigen so they can travel 12 hours. They should be 13-15 cm.

Anyway, I think I'll take 15 grass carp and then the rest of my system cycling won't be fishless. It is not ideal, but admittedly I am very excited about getting fish. The guy said he didn't have any food for these carp: just feed them grass and soft green veg like salads and such... Is going to be interesting in winter...

Ar carp very jumpy, by the way? I still need to have a cover for my fishtank.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 27th, '13, 13:39 
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Sorry, accidental double post. Don't know what happenend.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 29th, '13, 16:14 
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Update: Grass carp have arrived. Paid for 15, got 17. Survived a long trip home, but they were gasping for oxigen upon arrival. fortunately that was cured after release in FT.

Nitrite levels have gone down after partial water change. I will keep an eye on it.

They are a timid bunch, but last night they started eating. Munched away a salad leaf. My SLO is not exactly keeping up with the ... deposits .. that are appearing on my previously spotless FT bottom. Only the area a few cm from the location of the holes is getting clean. Mmmm... have to think up a solution for that.


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 29th, '13, 16:40 
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Don't be too zealous with the cleaning. You need to keep your bioslime happy!


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 Post subject: Re: Janna's Dutch system
PostPosted: Jul 29th, '13, 21:30 
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how big are the fish Janna?


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