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PostPosted: Nov 6th, '11, 10:45 
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OBO might be able to shed some light on this subject.


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PostPosted: Nov 6th, '11, 20:57 
Seriously, this cant be healthy.
Seriously, this cant be healthy.
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Hey? Whats the question?

Any question gets the answer of 3kg of fish per 100 litres of growbed at 2 litres of growbed gravel per litre of water, with all fish tank water turned over at least once per hour.

Anything outside of that is at your own risk :D

Costs for my system are approx 5k of gravel, 10k of plumbing, 5k of IBC's, 5k of electrical. Labour = astronomical.

Will grow around 1000kg of fish per year in Trout.


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PostPosted: Nov 6th, '11, 22:19 
Outbackozzie wrote:
Will grow around 1000kg of fish per year in Trout.


Is that what you've actually acheived OBO... or projected.. when all up and running???


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 04:37 
Brian Fanner wrote:
.....if you work on the fish to gravel ratio you need lots of gravel to provide lots of filtration for high stocking as per the norm of 3kg to 100liters of gravel. .......... In an ideal situation you would want as much as possible of both.

Big tank, masses of gravel filtration, clean water sump, pumping via a fine filter to nft returning to sump.

This ruling out more advanced forms of filtration like swirl filters or moving bead filters or drum filters due to cost and complexity and just the fact that such items are not really cheaply or readily available in Africa.....


Will it work? Yes. Will it achieve any real density of fish? No, excluding Tilapia, even then the growth will be negatively effected.

Recently, I have seen lots of talk about commercial systems using "hybrid" gravel and DWC/NFT system with an expectation of some unknown benefit. None of the benefits have been put forward yet. While the gravel will filter the water to a I doubt it afford you more fish growing capacity. I would have to ask how are you going to clean them?

Exchanging the water once per hour will still leave you with low culture density, more so if you are using gravel beds inline for filtration. Metabolically, the rate of oxygen consumption in the culture tank will beat you to it. Then the commercial viablility of the system will come into question. There is no reason why both aquaculture and hydroponics can not be commercially viable after all, these are your competitors.

The beds will certainly filter for a while, but eventually feed suspended solids back to the system. Those solids will reduce the growth of your fish and will have a negative effect on the entire system. What that impact will be depends on what form the solids are in (inorganic or organic). I know how much you guys don't like to talk about solids but in a commercial reality they are going to be an issue without adequate filtration.

Mineralization rates are very difficult to estimate because of the complexity of the systems that make it happen. Relying on the break down of your solids inline may be the undoing of the system entirely. Keep in mind that process will use both oxygen and will denitrify, either with or without oxygen. In other words a some of the nitrogen tied up in the solids and even the disolved nutrent you want for your plant growth, will be released into the atmosphere.

The infrastructure to manage the media beds will be quite large. Consider that the plumbing is used to transport the solid wastes to where you want them. This means to transport solids over long distances, the pipe velocities will need to be higher. To get higher velocities in the pipe work distributing the solids you will need either smaller pipes or much higher flow rates or even to the point of pumping them. Keep in mind you will need to distribute the solids evenly accross the gravel beds or they will clog very quickly at the entry point. Further to that, the entry point will become toxic and plant will not grow in it, losing precious space.

Then again after all that, at what level do you consider yourself commercial, supplying 3 or 4 resturants with fish?


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 04:49 
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This is great conversation. :) take a look at this man. He has an idea that makes a lot of sense when you really think about it. It is a new and different approach to aquaponics that sounds like it will be a lot better for the commercial future of ap systems.
http://www.growfish.com/aquaponics.html


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 04:57 
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The part you are not hearing from them is the fact most of the people who claim to be experts in the aquaponics know little or nothing about building fish culture systems or raising fish.


Good refreshing read. Thanks mate.


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 05:04 
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lol no problem. I thought is was interesting a guy looking at aquaponics from an aquaculture view. if what he says is true he succeeded in commercial aquaculture and aquaponics at the same time which is as far as I know impossible except by the way he described.


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 07:48 
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Earthan Group wrote:
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The part you are not hearing from them is the fact most of the people who claim to be experts in the aquaponics know little or nothing about building fish culture systems or raising fish.


Good refreshing read. Thanks mate.


Aquaculture people always think it's only about the fish... :roll:


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 07:50 
lol Joel, perhaps there is good reason for that mate.


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 07:55 
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Yes, because it's what they have always known...... AP is just not aquaculture, Mike Nichols will tell you that, he is one of the few that comes at it from the other side.


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 08:21 
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Well the man in the article I posted was looking to make the most out of both I think. What did you think about his idea earthbound??


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 08:42 
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Why is it that everytime uyou read something on AP they are the early pioneers?
According to what I have read, about 200 people magically started AP at roughly exactly the same time without ever talking to each other.
And then further on, with all their years of experience they have revolutionised something somewhere somehow blah blah blah.

As far as I can tell, all they have is an aquaculture system, and instead of changing water they swap it with a hydroponic system next to it...


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 08:48 
earthbound wrote:
Yes, because it's what they have always known...... AP is just not aquaculture, Mike Nichols will tell you that, he is one of the few that comes at it from the other side.


Like I said, just my opinion. I simply like the idea of making profit from both sources, not just the plants.


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 08:52 
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Yes all they are doing is aquaculture, but they are making almost a hydroponics solution with the fish poop which makes a lot more sense to me. idk


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PostPosted: Nov 7th, '11, 08:59 
werdna wrote:
As far as I can tell, all they have is an aquaculture system, and instead of changing water they swap it with a hydroponic system next to it...


Is that not aquaponics?

I get quite confused with the people coming out saying they can consult on commercial aquaonics but want to suggest it is something different to what you just descibed above.

Perhaps someone can explain to me what aquaponics is again, just in case I have forgotten.


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