Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

I totally agree with that, but I can't see Gillard doing the job, she has no balls (well we know that, but then again........... )
My preference will be to Labor, but I think she will be dumped within a year

Lets just hope they can find someone there that is a bit more of a leader.... Funny because the first speech I heard from her was great, I was really surprised... But now, if I hear the word "canvas", one more time...??? You mean "discuss" or "talk", canvas is something you use to make a swag or a cover for the back of your ute.

Burnsy, the hollow, inane, non-debate was the greatest insult to the intelligence ever foisted on the Australian public, however unaware, uneducated, or unconcerned they may be...

And showed both candidates as the limp wristed, visionless ventriluguist dummies of their respective "focus/poll driven" party machines...

And clearly demonstrated that neither political party has any concern as to the general public... or the future of Australia.... over and above playing the game to win the election for the purposes of attaining "power"... rather than representation, governance or vision...

Certainly Abbot spoke better than when he "debated" Rudd.... and Gillard was articulate, and from a "performance" viewpoint, near faultless...

But Abbot basically said nothing, and never extolled any co-ordinated policy or vision...


That which he did say... or has said in the last few weeks... is either "unfunded", unclear, contradictory, unsubstantiated, incorrect... or just plain bullshit...

For example... his pledge to "bring down the number of immigrants to 170,000".... is merely a promise to match the figure (projected to fall further in the next few years)... of the current immigration rate...

His promise to "stop the boats"... is bullshit... as it was under "Howard"... or under the current government..

The boats never stopped coming... they just stopped sailing to "Australia"... and now just head straight for hCristmas Island....

Or borders ARE secure... and have been for many years... with almost EVERY boat intercepted before entering Australian waters... and ALL refugees being processed on Christmas Island...

Which theoretically isn't part of Australia, after some creative poetic licence by Howard & co...

Similarly, Abbott... with many "fair dinkum" references to "working Australians"...

Said he felt and understood that the "increased cost of living pressures and interest rates"... were "pushing many "working Australians" "to the edge"

So what's he going to do about it... cut prices for food, goods and services.... raise wages... do both...

Or is he just full of shit...

No... he's going to overturn the mining tax... the basis of the return to surplus under Labour.... sell Medibank, can the NBN, cut green power initiatives, raise taxs, cut services etc...

And "bring the budget back into surpus"... (some how)... make us all better off... FFS...

And sorry Nocky...



But Abbott can not, and will not (nor will Gillard) be able to exert ANY control over interest rates, currency valuation etc... this is the provence of the indepedent Reserve Bank... the central bank of Australia...

Short of nationalising the Reserve...

And neither party, especially Abbott and the Libs... would ever contemplate that... the repercussions in foreign affairs and investment would be so huge as to bring this country to it's knees...

First of all, I know nothing much about politics and mainly because I am not required to vote (permanent resident).

Just reading this thread it seems to be me that the future path of Australia is somewhat doomed. I seem to have this feeling that the people of Australia got rid of the wrong person during the 07 election.

No... we just failed to get rid of the rest of the deadwood...

And that was Rudds mistake... he should have called a double dissolution... and punted the neo-cons into oblivion.... for the ultimate benefit of the "liberal" party itself as well...

It's this nanny nation mentality of the ALP that drives me insane, as mentioned earlier I fell into the quadrant that would like to get rid of government as much as possible. I believe we should all look after our own affairs and the basic role of government should be the protection of the people from violence, which would enable them to enter into free market transactions. To do so we need police and military but I am not sure that government should be involved in anything else.

That system of Govnt would be good for some individuals, but would it be good for the nation as a whole and how would the results of it impact on the standard of living of all Australians?

I suspect the police and military would need considerable expansion under such a regime.

now abbots saying a coalition government will suspend marine protection and give the fisheries minister as much say as the environment minister when it comes to marine conservation
( not that I'd trust a liberal environment minister anyway - look what our state one's been doing )

cause the poor fishing and tourism industries are under dire threat because of protection orders

so mush for sustainable fishing if this prick gets in, lets kill EVERYTHING we can and see how much money we make, surely something else will pop up for us humans to exploit when all the bloody fish are gone.
maybe we can start eating plankton ( wont be any whales left by then anyway so we might aswell )

Yep... if we kill everything else... we might as well eat plankton and algae.....

And kill ourselves.... algae produces close to 90% of the oxygen in the atmosphere...

Yeah...
Kings, queens, emporers, popes, religious zealota, despots, tyrants..... have been telling us for eons... that we need armies and police to protect ourselves... from ourselves....

And that we should surrender our "arms"... and trust them....

And punting the churches from the corridors of governement... by seperating "church & state"... opened up the "free market".... for the banks and industrial corporations.... who moved in the next day....

And have been the biggest advocates of the need for police & military...

To protect us....

If the people elect the government and the government protects the people - not from themselves but from the violence of others then it would work. Problem is that violence (and by violence I don't just mean physical) is often done especially by large enterprises that prevent genuine mutually agreed exchange i.e. free trade. I mean when a corporation goes into a place takes the resources from the ground bribes a small unelected/armed group but provides nothing to the real people they are harming, is to my mind incredibly violent.

Of course the reality we live in is complex but I believe the more a government collects information about us and removes our ability to defend ourselves the closer we are to complete oppression. When a government censures our information, when they monitor via video camera and force the collection of our personal activity data, when they increase the centralisation of control, and they encourage citizens to dob in sick workers I think we are a long way down the wrong path.

One of the things I like about this forum is that so many of the members think about what they are doing and not just in AP. While viewpoints may differ at least we are able to put them forward. And in this nation we at least have some vote.

Got to agreed with you there Novaris....

its sad

my brother is a normal 21 year old, I was drinking beer and watching the news with him and lamenting at our prospects and he scoffed and says " yeah, as if, Im not voting for a woman !"

I informed him of some liberal party policies and some of abbots views and he changed his mind in less than half a second
( surprisingly, first I said " yeah but gillard is an atheist , like YOU" and he didnt care )(( telling him to vote greens would have made him stare at me , call for mummy and ask why I'm a spy for the hippy russians ))

problem is Alllll his retard mates, and allll their retard friends dont give two shits about politics, dont watch the news, but if their friends find out they voted for a woman, they might get called poofters. and poofters dont get chicks ( or something like that )

were doomed.
more doomed that america

Yep, a decade of neo-conservatism, and mind numbing saturation tabloid news and sitcoms.... have consigned a generation of kids to political dumbness.... and consumerism...

Political engineering at it's worst.... or it's best, depending where you mindset is...