Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Hello again to all you fine folks. Been lurking off and on for the last couple years as i walk this path on getting my first system. Well my long dream is starting to come true as i am about to get a nice sized fish tank. Now i am going to have to figure out my grow beds.I am going to receive a 500 gallon stainless steal tank that my brother was using in his bait shop.

To give you a little bit of background. I own a place in south central Minnesota. Our weather conditions are wonderful. It can push 100F during the summer to -40F during the winter. Our water is really hard. 29 grains hardness with 12ppm iron so we have a softener thank goodness. Which leads me to my first question. Is soft water ok to used for fish and plants or should i use the hard water and let the grow bed filter it out.?

The other concern i have and was hoping to get your insight is about type of fish to raise. i would like to go with trout or talapia but i am going to have water temperature issues either way. Is it easier/cheaper to keep your water cooler or warmer?

The summer time temps will be to warm to keep the tank at 70 degrees or colder to keep trout. the spring/fall time temps are going to be to cold to sustain talapia. (in fact the way this summer is shaping up talapia will have a hard time staying warm) Neither season is long enough to raise them to eating size. And we are not fond of catfish. We would think about sunfish, or other local pan fish, if we could raise them to eating size in a year. I don't think the system will run very well all year long.

My last question is, does any one have experience kick starting a system that would be restarting from a frozen state? is there a certain temperature threshold that you wait for before inoculating the system with the previous years bacteria. Or do you just need liquid water. I am trying to figure out what my growing year would be. or if i should find a heating unit so i can start about the same time as the dirt garden.

The rest of this summer/fall will just be getting this system running. Maybe get a few plants going before the long freeze. Lots to do lots to do...

Cant wait to get this project started and thank you for all your inspiration and information over the years.

Welcome ..... with Temperature swings like that planning is going to be VITAL. Warm weather fish should be ok , as long as you start the baby tilapia indoors , they should have time to grow big enough to eat before the cold gets them. Look out for " GIFT " Tilapia ,, genetically improved ,, no scientists mooving genes ,, just fish bred and re-bred along growth speed etc.

Read through threads on glass-house ,, warming etc and you will get a lot of ideas ..... some good some questionable but all written with the intent to help others.

We have some members with partly indoor and outdoor systems to deal with real winters. I believe there is a member in Michigan (a bit more mild climate than yours but still true winter there) with a greenhouse set up that can grow some fish year round.

Your location will pose some challenges that you may need to deal with my methods other than the BYAP traditional outdoor flood and drain media systems.

Good Luck!!!!!

Hello and welcome,

I have been in and through MN quite a number of times both in summer and winter. During the winter, I always wonder..... why??

In the time that I have spent there, I have never noticed anything that would cause me to think that you could not raise trout, comfortably, all year. Your summers are very short. Even if/when it gets hot, it does not stay that way long. The nights cool down considerably. And the ground temp never gets hot. If you will put your tank in the ground, cover it from about half of the day light, and keep the system operating through the the night, you will never have any water temp issues.

I live in the southern most part of Texas. After our night time temps stopped dropping under 85deg F, and the days had been 95 -105 for more than 2 months, I measured my in ground tank that is half open to the sun, at 76 deg. F. This temp is fine for Trout if you keep plenty of Oxygen. You guys catch trout all summer long up there in the ponds and rivers. It won't be a problem... if you set up you system to run properly from the beginning. Don't take short cuts, do it right right.

As for heating, Chappo said it right.

have fun!
Mathew

Hey guys,

Thanks for the replies and well wishes.

Never thought about starting the fish off indoors. This sounds like an interesting prospect. I might have to take a look at this idea.

The greenhouse is in my 5 year to do list. It will not be done for at least a couple years i have a couple other projects that are a bit higher on the priority list.

I have been really interested in raising trout. To help keep the temperatures cool i was thinking of running some piping in the ground. Kind of a geothermal temperature regulation. Which is similar to the trout streams up around here. Streams that can hold trout though the summer has groundwater influence keeping water temps cool.

I know i don't need to cool things down a lot, just temper some of the hottest days. I am also thinking of putting the sump station in the ground. So i can go from fish tank to grow bed to sump tank and then back. I think that is the CIFT-PIST model. I like this model because i can usually guarantee that the fish will have water if the pump goes out. It should also be easier on the pump if the water is filtered via the grow bed. I have to see what options this tank will give me. If i can help it i don't want to poke any new holes in it if i don't have to.

Hello everyone,

Starting to put my system together and have a couple plumbing questions.

My grow bed is a large milk tank and i am trying to figure out how to get some type of siphon drain so i can set it to certain level. There is an existing outlet that has a hard to move ball valve, i think it is either a 1 inch or 1.5 inch diameter (2.5cm/3.8 cm). I think the milk tank is about 470 gallons with out the rocks (~1770liters). The fish tank and sump are 300 gallon (~1130liters) bulk fluid tanks.

Is there a way i can set up the auto siphon outside of the tank (loop siphon?), or should i look at cutting a hole in the bottom of the grow bed for a bell siphon. It is stainless steel so i was hoping to avoid cutting a hole. Will the existing opening on the bottom of the milk tank be large enough to drain the tank within a reasonable amount of time, will the loop siphon be a sufficient drain?

Don't think a "loop siphon" will cut it with that volume... go for an external bell siphon or an overflow standpipe if you're running a timber based system...

That is what i was afraid of.

Is 2 - 2.5 feet (61-76 cm) deep enough for fish? (i am thinking trout)

I keep jumping back and fourth if the milk tank should be a grow bed or fish tank. There are advantages to go either way with what tank is the fish tank/growbed.

Looks deep enough to be a fish tank... certainly deep enough for a sump tank...

I see cropping land in the background not too far from your fence, so make sure your fish are protected from spray drift until you build that greenhouse.

It is as protected as anyplace around here. I am surrounded by industrial agriculture. The north and west sides (predominate winds) are sheltered for the most part. The south is about 500+ feet away and you see the east side over 200 ft away.

Hey there, mate!

I just got around to seeing your thread. I know a lot of these are answers to old questions, but....

It is much harder to keep water 10deg warmer than cooler. Heat loss is through evaporation and, on a still day, a water surface loses heat as though it is about R0.1. Heat gain is much slower, with an R-value about R1 or R2, and via solar radiation that you can deal with through shading with cloth or a good cover of plants. Still, it would be nice to find a way to cool or insulate the exterior of that steel tank....

Because of this, I'd forget tilapia and go for trout (will eat voraciously even when water temps would kill tilapia and stop most other fish feeding, fast growing and entertaining, but need more pumping than others), catfish (perfectly happy with warm water and will survive cold, slow growing, but big), or bluegill (slow growing & tasty, same water temps as catfish).

I wouldn't soften the water. The iron and the calcium (if you have any) will be good for the plants.

Is that a stainless tank?! I'd probably use that for the fish tank with a tube running out the outlet, up to inner water height, then an air break T, and out to growbeds.
I'd slice the IBCs in half for growbeds. Put another IBC in ground as sump with some ply around it to prevent it collapsing. Rest one edge of two growbeds on the sump to keep it from floating out of the ground if the groundwater rises.

If you do use the steel tank for a growbed you could use a loop siphon (with large tube diameter), autosiphon, or bell siphon (same things topologically) and I bet you could get a 20 to 40gpm flow rate or better. You might not be able to drain it all the way as you need a good drop (a foot or so difference in water levels) to make that siphon work fast. Would you be happy only draining it a foot, then letting it fill again? It is a waste of gravel, but would certainly work while a deeper draining would be more iffy. You can try it and adjust...

I'd probably use the milk tank as fish tank too. Though a 1" drain isn't big enough for a big CHIFT PIST system with trout in my estimation. I like a 3" drain for my big CHIFT PIST fish tank drain. My big fish tank is around 700 gallons perhaps.

Perhaps the milk tank should be a sump then so you don't need to worry about cutting any new holes in it.

Ahh, but why would he need to "cut any new holes in it"... if he was using it as a "Chift Pist" fish tank?....

For a nice, large, low-head pipe leading to the growbeds. The 1" tube might do, but would probably require a half-meter drop and would negate the CHIFT if the pump ever stopped. I thing 3" (...75mm?) pipe might be a good size.