Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Rupe in WA it is suggested that they not be returned to the spot they were caught, whilst not a rule, same is for yabbies as mentioned earlier in the thread, it is not an offense to do so, the GWH is one of your country men and at the best of times doesn't care much for rules, this I stress is not my attitude, I understand about the spreading of these fish, maybe though 100 years to late for that, we can't spread them much more than they already are and devastating the local Marron supply, my trials are to benefit the removal of them, but will have more success in removing rabbits, more concern at the moment should be Tilapia as they are being used in system

As you can see they have been in WA for 120 years and already established, again we may be able to dwindle the population, the biggest method of transferring them is Via birds and not AP, as for the Mosquito Gambusia they were released by a government department in WA to combat Mosquito plagues in certain area's, they *frack* ed up as they actually eat baby marron and Native Pygmy Perch eggs, PP actually eat Mosquito's, so again AP can actually find a use for the pests and fix someone else's *frack* up, and the someone else in this case was paid to get it right.
Rupe I am slightly offended you would suggest I would do anything to bring AP down, I have done a lot of homework on this subject and am using the right channels to do so, yabbies are considered vermon here also, but people have turned yabbies into a profitable business, so if the fish are their why not use them?

Nocky, please wasn't suggesting that you were directly "bringing AP down".... and I was aware that Redfin have been around for sometime... just not sepcifically aware of WA rules...

From what you've quoted, I think the rules reflect the reality and the course of action is reasonable...

It's the general point, and attitude that concerns me... with regard to translocating species...

I'm actually in full agreement, that the keeping of some species currently listed as "noxious", in AP systems doesn't present a risk... or at least a very minimal one...

Same goes for RAS .... and as long as people approach things with awareness and plan/demonstrate accordingly... the rules are often relaxed....

It wasn't the keeping of Redfin in AP that I was objecting to.... just the cavelair... "it's my bloody waterhole, I'll do what I want".... attitude...

Lets bring carp and goldfish into the fracas. They are sold legitimately in pet shops and to people often with less regard to the country's well being as they live in a city or a large country town and generally have more empathy for their ex pet, and release it into the wild with little regard to the animals of the wild. I can use cats as an example because they are easier to see. I live 15 km from two small country towns, and have shot and trapped as many wild cats as "pre" tamed cats. Also a pet rabbit.

Carp and goldfish are now found widely throughout south-west waterways, possibly released from aquaria or introduced by migrants as traditional food.

Don't release carp or goldfish into waterways. These species should only be held in secure ornamental ponds that can't overflow and let fish escape. If you catch one, either eat it or dispose of it humanely.

Quoted from http://www.fish.wa.gov.au/docs/pub/IMPFreshwater/IMPFreshwaterPage03.php?0506

My farm dam next to the house has never overflowed. It could, but a lot more secure ornamental ponds would do so long before. At present it has Yabbies in it which if overflowed may affect natural species some 50 km away. I have though of putting Redfin in this dam as it may be more beneficial for me. (I still have yabbies in another dam!!)

My point is, it is my dam and if I did populate it with Redfin, the chances of overflowing is exceptioally small and our natural waterways are already populated with Redfin, and have been for over 100 years.

If Redfin prove to be successful in AP, I say go for it. AP is for harvesting. Ornamental ponds are, just that.

Yep - there's a wild population of swordtails in the Irwin River at Dongara - that could only be aquarists, and a wild population of Pearl Cichlids in the Whiteman Park area in Perth - had to be the same source again.

Hell, trout are introduced and I don't see anyone getting up in arms about them. Same with the kookaburra in WA, again, noone complaining though no dout it is outcompeting a native species somewhere.

Should we be introducing new, non-native species ? No, even though pet shops are allowed to sell them all - we've done enough bloody damage with the arrogant belief that we understand nature (cane toads being a perfect example out of thousands of candidates).

But neither am I going to be overly concerned about growing out a species that are throughout every significant southern WA waterbody already, particularly if it's not against the law.

Hell, trout are introduced and I don't see anyone getting up in arms about them. Same with the kookaburra in WA, again, noone complaining though no dout it is outcompeting a native species somewhere.

You haven't heard me about the kookaburras Nigel, thought they were lovely birds when we arrived at this property. A little bit of Australia, then one day found it had killed a baby bandicoot and left it for dead. Now I know why gum trees drop nuts, to throw at the annoying kookaburras.

Ok, sounds like Redfin might be a go, as long as I can convince fisheries that they cant contaminate goldfields waterways. Shouldnt be too hard considering the nearest one is 400km away

Have you paid up the Royalties to haye the right to say that you have a kookaburra in the old gum tree?

Had a feeling that someone would pick me up for that, but thanks for confirming my opinion that it was probably beating the hell out of something. We have them near here, but fortunately not too close - nothing, absolutely nothing is funny or cute at 4:40 am in summer (which is when the sun comes up here in WA).

Dicko, No, but you've got me worried

The reality in WA is that if we are to have any freshwater aquaculture/aquaponics of finfish, we need to grow introduced species (barra excepted). Cobbler don't grow large enough and black bream grow to slow. There's no other real candidates.

We either grow introduced species or we pull more fish out of the ocean !!

I have had a kookaburra fall out of an old gum tree just not far from the house!! Seems like a bit of lead may have "beaten it by a blow".

Yes they clean up many small native birds. And whats more I have had them land on my BBQ (hot) down at Sue's Bridge (C1's hinterland), and try to steal my meat.

Big difference with Trout Chilli is that in most WA waters they cant breed successfully so if Fisheries were to stop stocking them there would be virtually none left within a couple of years. With Redfin its the other way around in that once in a waterway you cant get rid of them. I know of several dams both here and in the east where fisheries have tried to get rid of them and both failed. The dams were drained and the remaining puddles were either dynamited or poisoned. Bothe water ways still contain Redfin today.
Rick, I know of many people who have put Redfin in their dams but not one who hasnt regretted doing it. Unless you have a use for tiny fish that are all scales and spikes I would strongly advise against it.

Advice accepted, thanks Gavin.

With your knowledge of this, if they were fished hard enough and fed well enough, would it be possible to keep abreast of there breeding??

Yep, understand that, but also know that it's only a hindsight learning, so sort of a difference, more a lucky break.




While I've got you here, and we're sort of on the subject, are you going to make it known to the forum when you're interested in taking orders this year ? I'm likely to be interested as I think my system will be up and running around March.

And unfortunately, you will be breaking the law. or at least breaking regulations of the fisheries department which states that you can not move non endemic fish species within different areas without prior permission.. I don;t know if that is law as such.

We were picked up on this once before by fisheries in a discussion about sharing Tilapia in the metro area... Fisheries were reading the forum, and wrote to Johnny7au about his offer to give tilapia to people...

So whatever you are going to do, I might suggest that you be careful.

Is non endemic the words Fisheries used EB?

Definition of Endemic. "Regularly found among a people or in a country or district"

We would have to be safe Trout, Yabbies, Redfin etc