Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Have 3 photo's of a sick fish, I have about 100 PP in a tank with yabbies and mussels, at first I thought a baby mussel was the cause but looks far more serious now, I also have 50 Trout in another tank, they seem fine, the other PP are fine and yabbies are violent as ever, system has just finished cycling, nitrites a couple of days ago were at 1ppm but were as high as 5ppm and ammonia was as high as 2ppm, both have dropped to 0 in the last 2 days nitrates are about 15 and PH has always been around 7.4, water is clear and about 9c deg, PP can handle water as low as 2c and as high as 30c, in the pics you can see a sort of blister, the fish itself is about 65mm long (2.5")
Pics were taken with phone, blister can be seen in middle and much clearer in bottom pic, in bottom pic large blister above the eye on top of head, other pic shows unusual black marks.
Is it Nitrite poisoning? as mentioned no other fish are affected as far as we can see

I had a bit of a look on the net, and found this, hope it helps...

Gas bubble disease
Gas Bubble Disease is caused by a sudden dramatic change in gas pressure in the aquarium. This can happen by changing too much water at one time or by adding cold water to the fish tank. Gas bubbles form in the fins and skin of the fish. The bubbles look like blisters and are very easy to see. The skin will crackle if you run your finger across it. If not treated in time, gas bubbles in the bloodstream will kill the fish. The treatment is to add alot of aeration to the aquarium. Lights should be left off to minimize stress. If you see alot of bubbles that have already popped, consider adding a general antibiotic to guard against secondary infection

Should have posted the web address also, has a lot of fish diseases, looks like it has some similar to what Rick is experiencing also...

http://badmanstropicalfish.com/disease.html

Thanks NF, we now have 2, but I haven't changed water, water temp is up and down as the weather we have is bizarre, 25 one day and 13 the next, have a big air pump in trout tank and PP tank is where GB water drains into, water is still just draining when next cycle starts, so plenty of air I feel

My guess would be the severve temp drop we are currently getting at night, maybe it's time to try the reduced pumping cycle at night that you and Rick have been discussing...

Maybe increase the time between cycles from approx 5pm, and then have the pumps off over the period that OB suggests.

We're in for another cold one tonight.

Have no idea still, one died but other is swimming upside down because of weight of lump, I should but it to sleep but am studying it, I have it in a bucket with air ans stone, it actually swims to the air and gets blown around possibly to get put up the right way, what I have found in a US site

From the pictures you can see black masses, the fact they were submitted foe examination in 1873 would suggest not a lot of work has been done in this area, but still above no mention of blisters, the survivor seems fit enough since adding air, just disorientated, all other PP are fine as are the Trout

Have actually sent an email to FJ Stephens(author of above artical) , it didn't bounce so I assume he will get it, and wrote it after 1873, the fact he has an email address would also confirm this
will post comments if he reply's

Both died, gas bubble disease is plausible, blister disappeared when they were dead, but the black mentioned above was still present in them, hopefully FJ will get back, still no problems with any other inhabitants of either tank, may sound silly but sunburn could be another cause

I was pleased to get a reply from Dr Stephens explained my water test results to her over a 2 week period plus other info in this thread, her reply

So some other interesting info from the Dr, we probably over stress when we get rises in ammonia and nitrites
The levels I quoted to the Dr were PH 7.4, Ammonia 1-2, Nitrite 1-2 (but as high as 5 for a couple of days) and Nitrate 0, I explained these levels were for about a week or so and ammonia eventually went to 0, this is when Nitrites went to 5, and also have told her that Ph is still 7.4 and others 0 except nitrates are at about 15-20 I also suggested the two dead fish could have been weaker

Think you missed the whole point Nocky...



That's why sometimes fish are fine at short term elevated levels of ammonia during cycling...

It all depends on your pH... and temperature...

Winter helps in this regard... but doesn't help the speed of bacteria in cycling...

Can't help from my recent bit of experience with my trout, other than if you see any trout that look like they have got sugar crystals over them then you may have the same as what I had. Great help aren't I.
Has there been any zinc leach in from anywhere?

Nah got the point Rupe, that temp was down and pH was down so the fish could tolerate levels that I had much longer, obviously wouldn't do the same in summer.
Nah rick only PVC and Brass and a corry roof, one trout has 2 bright white dots on it's head but look like part of the fish and not spots, noticed a couple of weeks ago but still feeding like crocodiles and swimming like the thorpedo, so not stressed

Nocky:
Brass isn't good, even one fitting exposed to your circulating water can poison your fish over time and if your " Corry" roof means Galvanised corrugated iron sheet roof, or even if it is Zincalum coated, you will get an accumulative build-up of toxic Zinc levels. Galvanising is pure Zinc (either applied as a hot dipped coating or by electrolosis) and Zincalum is just a coating of Zinc and Aluminium in a loose physical (not Chemical) composition, either way, you will get free Zinc ions in the water which will eventually kill your fish! They can't get rid of these toxic metals and it just keeps building up until it kills them!
Any use of Galvanised products must be lined with a potable water safe product to stop Zinc leaching. "Aquaplate" or similar for rainwater tanks is obligatory. I have used an EDPM, food grade liner for my Zincalum Mini-orb Grow Beds, with Gold Seal food grade Adhesive/Sealant to overcome this exact problem.
As the TV add once said, "It won't happen overnight, but it will happen!"
Get rid of any metal fittings, valves or equipment that comes into contact with the circulating water, unless it is 316 or 304 stainless steel or Chrome or Nickel plated (even then the plating can wear off and expose the base metal!) Didn't I see on this forum a case of accumulated toxins with an old enamelled Cast Iron bath tub Grow bed that had exposed the base metal when a small section off enamel was knocked off? Cast Iron contains lots of toxic by-metals, it is not Steel! Even rusted steel can provide enough excess iron for your fish to be unhappy, the plants may like it by the fish won't.
Cheers IanK

Yeh, sounds like my problem:
When I used the pressed metal bathtubs some of the enamel had been knocked off - after 1 year of troubles, I tested the water and found out Nickel was leeching into the water.


With that system I also had ulcerations occur, like this one:

Ian I agree with zinc roofs but the corry roof has been there 30 years, My last system was a corry tank and most things including the PP lived in the corry tank for a year with no problems at all, brass is the only way I could go to connect the tanks and feel confident the join wouldn't break, 304 still would rust and 316 would be far to expensive.
Gemmel unbelievable damage to the fish but I don't think the PP had ulcers, I have a bath system as well but tub looks fine no chips on the inside anyhow, have goldies and PP in the tub and they have no problems