Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Far bit of OT and skirt waving going on... no offence girls!
Sorry lungy!

WTF???...

I'll say it again Kuda.... I never mentioned, one way or another, the size or requirement of the sump tank

In all honesty I haven't even calculated it..... now knowing that it's intended to run a chift pist I might do so.

But as other prominent members had suggested that a bigger sump might be needed I didn't feel the need to either comment or argue the point...

I figured they probably knew what they were talking about and had done the calculations and/or were talking from experience

Likewise Lungy.... thought I was raising a "possible" concern as to your posted design modification and inviting "informed" opinion....

Wasn't aware that I was either OT or "arguing" at all

Hydraulic systems and flows are something I've always struggled to visualise and I sometimes write as I'm thinking or trying to think things through so please don't take offence.... (Thanks for your PM's and explanations Kuda)

I'll try and clarify what I was getting at...

IF the sump was under capacity (and probably was) then sure it would drain completely or near enough to it...

But by adding the extra 800ltr of barrel capacity and allowing for that capacity to equalise to the sump..... would the sump level ever drop below the barrel outlet .... letting the barrels drain fully??

Suppose it all depends on the total drain (therefore level) that the sump lowers to before the next growbed drain..... will that level be below the level of the barrel outlet?

If not then the barrels will always retain a certain level.... will that level be low enough that the mix of new water from the growbed drain be enough to stir/mix any still water and/or sedimentation left in the barrels...

At 300mm (the level of the barrel outlet/sump inlet) it would require that all 800 ltr of the barrels plus (if my maths is correct) at least 600ltrs (roughly coz the IBC/sump wouldn't be filled to the brim) of the sump would need to be drained in order to drop below the barrel outlet/sump inlet and therefore empty the barrels completely.

So that's a total of 1400ltrs...... all of which needs to be pumped from the sump before the growbeds begin dumping to the barrels again.....

Not sure this will happen is what I'm trying to say.... I make the growbed capacity to be 4 x 225ltr = 1000ltr.... to fill, then they begin to dump back to the barrels...

To me, this means that the growbeds will begin to dump back to the barrels before the sump pumps more than the 1400ltr required to drop below the outlet level...

Result is that the barrels will possiblely always maintain a certain level... This is what I had envisaged.....

May not be a problem at all, and Lungy is certainly better off having spare sump capacity.... just raised a concern in me though as to possible effects.

Hopefully my explanation is clearer and maybe I'm over-thinking the situation

Some suggestions:
1) put the outlets of the barrels in the bottom and run it into a Tee and the 50mm pipe (no stagnation)

2) have a [s]reasonable[/s] bloody large sized bleeder (as KP suggested) not only for water transfer but it would restrict the siphon flow into the barrels...if there is pressure in the barrels, air will try to escape back up the siphon pipe (and prematurely stop the siphonage )

How we going there Lungy, how deep have we made this hole in your backyard...not to worrt, this is BYAP at its best/worst

Was thinking something similar since Rupe`s concerns were much my own with water flowing through each barrel before getting to the sump could cause problems with stagnent water.
So design number #22 up for perusal 50mm from bottom bung then into tee in 100mm pipe as main drain added sketch to show.
Also added in growbeds above sump which will autosiphon back into sump for more aeration & draw the sump level a bit lower.



At this stage that`s probably the easy bit.



What`s a backyard for if not for digging up

Filling in when you've made a mistake?

`
+1 except I draw ,Thanks for the input Rupert It`s helped me visualize a few things



I don`t think it ever will unless I run low as autosiphons will be kicking in at different cycle times for each bed so would be rare to coincide with each other.



It worried me too so redesign was in order I`ll get there in the end.

Sounds like you're pretty close lungy... like the redesign....

Didn't know if you had enough room and fall to go out the bottom.... was trying to visualise a barrel setup under the growbeds in relation to the photos you'd posted. Thought maybe you'd already considered/measured and decided there wasn't enough fall to the sump.

At least with the tee off the bottom it should allow near all of the water to mix and flow to the sump and prevent any silt build up even if the sump never gets below the outlet level.

Part of my problem with nutting things like this out is I can't draw for nuts

Oh and darn good idea that breather pipe Kuda.... I'll have to remember that idea and application in case I need it for my big system... have a feeling I might.....

This is the final layout with all beds & strawberry towers in place.

Hi again Lungy:
I find your "distributed sump" idea interesting. If each bed has its own barrel accounting for its sump needs then why would you even need to have the 1000L sump? Couldn't this system get by with just the barrels under each bed now? I.e. connect the barrels for equalization and put the sump pump in one of them.

In your sketches it looks like if you did that you could fit another of Joel's beds where the half barrel beds are.

Looking good! I can see after one maybe two years of the system running you'll have roots growing from the first bed all the way to the sump. So keep an eye on that.

hehe i'm just in awe over the sketchup work....the system looks like it'll be impressive too!

Thanks Rupe. The breather was a necessity for me. Siphon wouldn't start