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Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
http://byap.backyardmagazines.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=16820		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  aqualandsfl [ Jun 4th, '13, 01:56 ]
Post subject:  Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
So I am stuck on a new design, as far as water distribution...I was thinking about using an indexing valve to separate the system into different "zones" but the indexing valve requires the pump to turn off in order to switch zones, I was wondering if anyone had recommendations as far as which would be better for maintaining the pump on at all times and being able to change "zones" without shutting off the pump...a sequential valve or an inline manifold used in irrigation?

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Author:  Marc d W [ Jun 4th, '13, 06:41 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
im sure Ruoert will be able to add his considerable experience to this but in my experience anything that get caught under the diaphram of the valve will prevent it from closing. as we are trying to pump waste out of the tanks to the beds i would suggest that it wont work and will lead to valves not closing.
Author:  RupertofOZ [ Jun 4th, '13, 08:21 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
Why use six valves.. when you can use one... :D

(4 port model shown)

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Author:  RupertofOZ [ Jun 4th, '13, 08:24 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
But yes, you're correct... you do need to interrupt the flow... to sequence the aquaponics valve....

FYI... the "aquaponics valve" is designed to work with the typically low flow pumps used in aquaponics...

Irrigation valves usually require mains pressure to work...
Author:  Marc d W [ Jun 4th, '13, 11:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
If you are rally keen on using solenoid valves, there are low pressure direct acting solenoid valves that may work that operate at very low pressures (0 to 3psi) and high volumes. I have never tried these due to the cost and the possibility of not shutting off properly. I looked at this some time ago as a solution to my problem but found my only real cost effective option was an indexing valve or 2 pumps. I went for 2 pumps ($0 additional cost beyond the cost of the second pump).
Author:  Yavimaya [ Jun 4th, '13, 11:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
One would hope that with the speed of water flow, the squishiness of the "solids" and the size of the valve head, that in the event of the 1 in 40 million chance of something getting stuck in the solenoid happens, that the solids would simply be squashed and wouldnt cause a problem.

If it was me, i would go for the solenoids, simply because as you said you dont want to turn the pump off, the others need your pump to turn off, this is not very good for versitility.
Author:  LowCarbTNPer [ Jun 4th, '13, 12:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
You could also use an indexing valve and a solenoid to stop the flow to switch it over (mag drive pumps won't be hurt by a couple of seconds of blocked flow).
Author:  RupertofOZ [ Jun 4th, '13, 12:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
In my experience... and others.... the problem with solenoids... especially any low pressure ones.... is that they just don't handle the "dirty" water of aquaponics.... and just foul up....

Not just from the solids... but more from bio-film buildup....
Author:  Yavimaya [ Jun 4th, '13, 14:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
Thats a fair point rupert, i thought that might be a factor, but since they have fairly strong springs and are designed to close under spring pressuse, i thought that would have been more than enough.

I suppose pneumatic is the way to go as far as that goes.
How do those other "valves" work? would they not be very similar in setup to a solenoid?
Author:  RupertofOZ [ Jun 4th, '13, 14:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
Yavimaya wrote:
since they have fairly strong springs and are designed to close under spring pressuse, i thought that would have been more than enough.

True... but for that reason... they require mains pressure... or are designed accordingly....

Most pond pumps don't deliver anywhere near mains pressure

Quote:
How do those other "valves" work? would they not be very similar in setup to a solenoid?

Yes... but the spring pressure is calibrated to the low flow that is comparable to the normal range of pumps we use in AP..

Many of the solenoids... are actually 24v electrically controlled...
Author:  Yavimaya [ Jun 4th, '13, 14:52 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
Yea i dont understand how water pressure matters, since it is spring loaded and is electrical, unless i am missing the fact you can buy non electric ones (?).
I have hooked up a 24v sol. to my system and didnt have a problem, the only reason it doesnt still run is that they are backwards from what i needed - normally closed, i needed open.

oh well, i wont make you explain the nitty gritty to me, i still cant see how the solenoid being "over powered" is a bad thing, ill learn more one day.
Author:  RupertofOZ [ Jun 4th, '13, 14:56 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
Forgot to mention.... the "aquaponics valve"... is purely mechanical/ hydraulic... in operation.... it is not a powered device... :wink:
Author:  Yavimaya [ Jun 4th, '13, 15:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
How do you set opening and closing times/ intervals?
And where might one source such valves?
Also, is your website no longer coming?
Author:  solarmon [ Jun 4th, '13, 15:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
Hi,

What about using a holding/resevoir tank with a bell siphon. This would simulate the pump shutting on and off because of the siphon stop/start cycle. Then you can still keep the pump going all the time.

Cheers,

Mon

EDIT: Although thinking about it, I'm not sure if the siphon flow from this holding/resvoir tank will create enough pressure for the indexing valve to function. You would probably need to dump the water in to another tank/container connected to the indexing valve?
Author:  RupertofOZ [ Jun 4th, '13, 15:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: Sequential Valve or Sprinkler Manifold?
The aquaponics indexing valve does not require pressure to sequence.... the sequencing is initiated by the interruption of flow... (min 2 secs)
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