Backyard Aquaponics
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Started this topic as a platform for debate about issues in the forthcoming election....

I'd suggest that comments should be referenced and quoted if possible...

And realise and hope that everyone accepts that we might not agree with all that might be said by anyone person or group...

But in the belief that there are issues at stake not only for our own life/styles but that of our children and grandchildren and the nation and world as a whole.

I believe this is a crucial election for Australia and deserve/demands a level of debate that is or has been generally lacking of late.

My bugbear.... Industrial Relations....


Workplace Relations Minister Joe Hockey has today confirmed the Howard Government's intention to go further on industrial relations and get rid of trade unions altogether if re-elected.

Speaking on ABC radio this morning, Mr Hockey said: "The days of unions are essentially over."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJaXU1Uu3zY

The Howard Government has already cut workers' protection from unfair dismissal and allowed penalty rates, overtime, and redundancy pay to be reduced. Now they plan to get rid of all protections for working people, including unions.

A Government document already shows that John Howard wants to push an extra 1.5 million workers onto AWAs. Peter Costello has previously admitted he wants to further cut workers' protection from unfair dismissal.

You can view the leaked documents and the quotes from Mr Costello on the "rightsatwork" website

www.rightsatwork.com.au/campaigns/theywillgofurther

Now Mr Hockey has revealed the Government wants to get rid of Australians' right to be represented by unions altogether if it is re-elected. This is a stunning admission of the Liberal Party's future agenda on industrial relations.

You'll recall Liberal Finance Minister Peter Costello said in a leaked recording last year that the Government intended to undertake a "new wave" of extreme industrial relations changes if elected.

Before the last election, John Howard and Peter Costello didn't say anything about their radical plans to change Australia's workplace laws.

But once they got elected it was a different story. And the Liberals want to go even further with their IR changes.

Joe Hockey's slip up reveals the Howard governements further extreme IR agenda.

The Howard Government want more people on AWAs, they want penalty rates to be up for grabs, they want people to be able to be sacked without rhyme or reason. And now Mr Hockey's slip up on AM shows they want unions gone.

Read the transcript and listen to the whole interview on AMHere and the "News" article Read article

He said Australians viewed unions as irrelevant and were choosing not to join them, a trend that started under former Labor prime minister Bob Hawke.






Push 1.5 million more workers onto AWA individual contracts

Government documents confirm the Liberals want an extra 1.5 million workers on individual contacts - from 5% of workers to 20%.




Scrap unfair dismissal protections for all workers

Peter Costello wants a future Liberal Government to consider scrapping unfair dismal protections for all workers - including those in businesses with more than 100 staff.







Abolish all awards and the industrial relations commission

Government Minister Nick Minchin says he wants the Liberals to go further on IR after the election, including abolishing awards and the industrial relations commission ... from an address to HR Nichols society March 3 2006

http://www.youtube.com/v/WiUtvnwjkTw


Cut the 'fairness test' and introduce US style minimum wages

The National Farmers' Federation say they want a re-elected John Howard to repeal the so-called 'Fairness Test' and introduce a US style minimum wages system in Australia



IMHO, while I have no doubt that there have been abuses of union power and practices over the past 50 years, just as there have been grave abuses of industrial law and safety provisions by many employers....

We have evolved an industrial relations system and laws over that time to reflect that fact and to offer protections to workers and employers accordingly.

Unions and industrial laws evolved, as have all laws, in response to the fact that not all people can be trusted to "do the right thing".

We have collectively and individually built both our own personal wealth and this nations wealth within a framework of industrial laws that seek to protect the health, safety and basic minimum rights that we have all enjoyed throughout our lifetimes, particularly those that have less ability to defend or expouse their positions.

so thank you Mr Hocking for putting this issue back on the agenda and revealing the Liberal parties true postition....

Now can you explain...

Why should are children not have the same conditions and protetions that we ourselves demanded and enjoyed?

And why, if under both the Hawk and Keating governments union influence was in fact diminished/deminishing, that you keep harping on about the power of unions and/or the influence they may have in a future Labour government?

And show us the proof that your policies have in fact actually been directly responsible for job creation that wouldn't in fact have occurred anyway and showw us how your policies will in anyway increase productivity.

Now why is it that they always move to exreems.



Workers have rights to a fairs days pay for a fair days work. Its the Australian Way. Also, its also about requirements. If im going for a house loan, the bank wants to know ive got a stable job with a history of stability.

As a worker, ive got no problems to a point that business have a right to control their workforces as they see fit to maximise profits. But not at the expence to workers minimum rights.

Unfair dismissal - Sure, if a business is doing it tough, its the business right not to be forced to keep workers because they cant legally get rid of them, but where is the balance...

Do AWA's reward workers for working over time.

As a teacher, I argue something with my kids at school. If you want to be paid 50 000 a year, you have to make AT LEAST 50 000 a year + all the things the business has to fork out like super etc. So you probabily need to make at least 75 000 for the business just to break even.

A business doesnt have to pay you high wages just because you "in a job". You have to be worth something to that business.

And thats what UNIONS need to realise, accept and fight on that front. Unions need to educate their members that they need to fight for agreements that reward business for their hard work, not just because its their "right to be paid and not fired".

That means an AWA should stipulate a number of things:
1. A worker at full time must work a miniumum number of hours

2. A If a worker is paid from hours 9 - 5, then they dont have to do preperation or clean up outside of those hours, or be 1/2 early on time (Happened to me sister now, shes paid 10 - 4 but must be at the business to start at 9:30 preperation and cant leave to 4:30 because of cleanup, then only pay her 10 - 4)

3. If a worker does overtime, then they must be paid at the going rate for it

4. A worker should only get a bonus if they meet some sort of performance criteria.. sold more, worked more etc. Bonuses shouldnt be expected, and it must be paid in wagees, not a "christmas ham"

5. The tax system must be simplified to account for workers expenses... A worker wears a uniform, but rules, logos etc means some worked cant claim for some equipment.

6. Sick pay (10 days a year) super and entilements are paid to a independant group out of control of the business and paid at the time of the workers pay each pay. It should never happen that a worker gets fired for "restructureing" and then cant get their entitlements because the company goes bankrupt, the money should already be there.

7. Business need encentives to employ poeple back on full time loads, not casual. This may have more to do with getting rid of someone as well but Id say a rule like this:

If you are working a 38 hour week when you start the business and on probation for 3 months (like all workers are), after that 3 months if you are working at 38+ hours still, when you come off probation you still auto full time status. Business dont want to make someone full time because its harder to fire, must pay certain taxes, holiday pay etc... All business should have the same rule... That all workers get holiday, sick leave etc... the same paid pro rata on your wage/ hours worked. SO if you worked 38 hours, you get 100% sick and holiday pay for the fortnight. If you worked 16 hours, you get 50% and so on. In this way there is no such thing as a full time job then or casual - just the number of hours you work.

8. Workers should be allowed to turn themselves into a business. In this way they become contract workers. So your not hired or emplyed by a company, you are contracted by them. So anything you need or required for you to do your job has to be supplied by you.. and in turn becomes tax deductible. I know of someone who did this. He has his own business so the one we were working for contracted him unlike me who was employed by them. The result, is that the business that contracts you can claim 10% of your wages for GST as you are providing for them a service. The company also doesnt have to give you a number of things, but as you supply yourself, everthing is tax deductible.

Defence policy

Simple, we support the united nations at all times.

We also support and really only want to infuence our own region. Why have we got troops in Iraq.

Iraq - I have no trouble going to iraq if the UN did so. All the UN had to do is say youve breached the resoluion 17 times... after 3 times they should have gone in... You DONT defy the UN - or the UN has no power. And thats the US's main problem and mine too.

I hate the whole WMD argument. It didnt matter - All they had to do was say youve breached resolutions.

Simplify the UN...

HEALTH

The question is simple - It doesnt matter who has control... what is the level of care we want in this country and who has the right to access to it... sorry this might offend BUT...

1. Transplants - Smokers and drug use pushes you to the bottom of the list.

2. Plastic Surgery - Kids with burns - fine of course, But little jimmy wants to become little jenny - get private. That and purely cosmetic stuff

3. Hospitals - If your violent, sorry too bad. Doctors and Nurses have the right NOT to be abused

4. Improve the system of triage and outpatients... Fine if you earn as a family below x amount (use tax statement as proof or similar) you get a public health card and can visit a private doctor who then treats you as a bulk billing patient. If you earn over the amount - Shoudl we canvas that you owe X% of your visit. Either our taxes can pay 100% for services or it cant. If it cant, utilise the doctors available. Trouble is, whats x amount?

Lets say all based upon tax rate

1 - 6000: Free health care
6000 - 30 000: You pay 15% of the doctors bill
30 000 - 75 000: You pay 30% of Doctors bill
75 000 - 150 000: You pay 75% of Doctors bill
150 000 and over: you pay 100% of doctors bill

BTW: Could the same be done for education?

1 - 6000: Free Education care
6000 - 30 000: You pay 15% of the Edcuation bill
30 000 - 75 000: You pay 30% of Education bill
75 000 - 150 000: You pay 75% of Edcuation bill
150 000 and over: you pay 100% of Edcuation bill

Sure, its a user pays system, but set scaled so those more likely to be able to afford are asked to foot the larger bills...

Hey I could be on the wrong track here.. but this all depends on 2 questions:

1. Can we afford 100% free health care with no rationalisation?
2. Can we afford 100% free educaiton (france does)...

This is just to provoke.. nay... encourage discussion... Im looking for policies of the parties for long term solution, not just what will get them elected... and I cant trust John Howard as far as I can see him through his eye browes...



"Sorry for the rant"

? 2/ is this something that affects you personally? the jimmy/jenny thing is it a real issue?

and 3/ what sort of violent condition are you refering to....violent ppl in general ..ppl violent because they are intoxicated or violent ppl that are in hospital to be treated for their possible genetic/ hereditory dispostion....bit vague there man


lol im still stuck on the lil jimmy thang...you crack me up



oh and if they implement your suggested models then that would make it fairer for everyone.....the world seems to need poor folk n rich folk...it seems to need the great divide between the classes is why nobody has changed the tax system esp the part that allows the "rich gettn richer and the poor get the picture"

yes it is an important election but be honest...who really does trust a politician.......who out of bonzai and kevin07 is telling the truth...none of em lol.....who can you trust...neither...the ONLY good thing about kevin07 is that we are tired of bonzai's bs and we now have a choice...something that hasnt been offered by the labour party in a LONG time

If it aint broke why fix it ?
I would like to vote for Kev, but he has too many lefty mates for my liking.

I agree, but there is NO WAY thats ever going to happen. i was paying nearly $6,000 just in fuel and tolls at one time. you think they're going to hand back that sort of money? even thought it was expended earning money that was taxed? no way



Because its about to fall apart, like the perfectly good used car you buy........... and then they can blame the next gov.

Seriously? i hope labour doesn't get in. not becasue i don't want them, but becasue IMHO we're heading for a serious economic disaster (not necessarily caused by the current gov) but sure as hell labour will bear the blame for it if they get in and then the libs will have another 10+ year reign. i'd prefer them to cop the blame for it at the expense of another 4 years.

i think we need to see what kevin07 n julia gillard have to offer.....the libs will always be white collar....will always be boring...esp costello.....aka mr personality....sure the alp will cop the blame for the economic downturn but we just follow what happens overseas nomatter who is in power and hopefully the clever ppl....non liberal voters....can see that and not just be childish about it...i dont like the idea of being under a liberal government...a costello government for 4 +....im sure even mr costello's brother feels the same...btw left can be good unless youve lived wrapped in cotton wool all your life....AND if there was a huge economic crash the kevin07 will get to show us what he may have....a backbone...or wth gillard behind him..a huge set of balls

the view of a conformist?.......better to die on your feet than to live on your knees hey

have you seen the hearald-suns weekly circulation numbers?

Pffff.

liberal voters?

not clever people............put it that way. i read it for a bit of a laugh, but the amount of people that are like "i read it in the hearald-sun" ergo it must be true...... does not give me confidence on the free thinkingness of our population...............too much fluoride maybe?

or too much "whats hot and whats not".....i hear the comic section and the techo section are good in it lol

I've been a union member all my working life - but have no respect for the union. Do nothin for me and in my view spend all their time acting for people who have done something wrong. Now I am in what they would consider to be 'management' ranks - other than paying my weekly dues, the next encounter I am likely to have with the union is when one of my staff members decides that they don't like the way they are being treated (eventhough, if this happens, it will be them taking offence at having been performance managed for doing something very bad). No point betting on what representation I'll get from my union (which I pay a handsome amount of money to each week) at that point. My union is known to let people join after they have done wrong and then the union will represent them.

This is kinda off topic, but shits me to tears - might have been better off in the gripes thread.