Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Hmmm interesting tangent to the thread...

I'm with steve on the interest rate rise thing. Having relatives and friends who get payed out from a job and instead of paying a chunk off their morgage they buy a wide screen flat panel TV, then complain about the interest rate rise.

I do have a quiet chuckle at the ones they interviewed on "current affairs" type programs, you know the battler struggling to pay his morgage being interviewed with a VB in one hand and a ciggy in the other, and wide screen TV in the background

To some degree I agree with you but in reality,
the luxuries that are forcing the rate rises are not the general luxuries your talking of...more like takeovers/executive salaries/10+houses full of stuff/mega boats/2&300k cars/mcmansions/150K for a labourer/etc.

also I don't believe the 10% (90% of homes are unencumbered) of the population that are trying to buy their first home are rushing out to remortgage for a holiday/car/plasma/facelift/boobjob, are causing the problem.

There is an illusion that the poor bugger working their butt off to pay for their home is causing the problem, I can assure you they are not!

Inflation is a result of a booming economy just as deflation is what happens after a boom.

We have been riding high on the boom, whilst most european banks reduce rates we are increasing them-this is for the banks,(such good corporate citz they are) just ask Rup!

Have a look at the fixed rate westpac are offering ATM 8.25% for 5 years
less than the variable rate now of 8.27% the pricks are locking ppl into long fixed terms, 10 years @8.35%...

Supply and demand you are right, corporations are suppling and banks are demanding!

Banks make more from fees than from interest rates.

Interest rates go up so do rents, rents go up so do the number of investment properties, more investment properties, houses go up, it is a vicious cycle...
but hey as the rich get richer the poor get the picture...
cue ol'Pet garret...
not meant to be an arguement but something I know a little of

dunno C1, not convinced yet.................. i HOPE i havent been taken for a ride in what i believe, but it sor of makes sense. have you seen what our credit card debt is? how many billion? i'm not sure.

to be quite honest, if some one gave me 300K for doing my job i'd take it! AND buy a 200K car. BECAUSE I COULD.

not saying accept your lot in life, by all means strive for what ever you desire, but be true to yourself.

just today i drove past a flooring place offering new floating boards. no deposit, no intrest, no repayments for 3 years.

why has the american market gone to the shit? my understanding of it is that the finance companies were dumb enough to offer loans to those who could not repay and the people were dumb enough to accept. Thats my point.

Hell, if you've got the cash spend it, you cant take it with you. but if you don't then be a little sensible about it.

Happiness is what you make it not how close you are to the jones's


THIS was number 10,000

Well, being that I live in a third world country... I can tell you it is now a shock when I visit the USA. The displayed wealth is unreal. But the actual wealth? Only in the hands of a few and those are generally the ones with self control.

Just because you see it doesn't mean you have to buy it. I agree with Steve, there is way too much focus on purchasing things, way too little on building assets.

We never did buy a lot for our kids for Christmas - like 100 dollars each. Most years we don't even share gifts ourselves, we just aren't into it that much. If one of us really wants something, we just get it - we have worked at not wanting much.

I am sure our kids resented the fact they didn't have tons of junk for Christmas at times and that we didn't always have fancy stuff (we had very good stuff though) - but we did pay for their education and we have managed to earn enough for ourselves for retirement as well as for them. I assure you they don't mind that one bit!

The key in my mind is not to treat yourself from your salary but from your investments. When you have enough extra money coming in from investments that you can splurge a little - sure, you earned it. But if all you have is salary, you better get that money working, and not eat your seed corn! Your salary is princible, don't touch the princible for toys. Learn to live off the profit of your investments - then when you have plenty of money coming in from your investments, you can retire. (if you want to)

Sort of like our aquaponics systems. You don't eat the fish you put into the system until they grow and replace themselves or pretty soon, your system is no longer productive. Sounds simple, but most people just use up all the resources they have and borrow on the future - and then wonder why they can't meet their bills.

By the way - just to let you all know, by almost any measure, we are wealthy. And we were poor as dirt for our first 8 years together. We got wealthy the good ole fashion way, saving, reinvesting, living simply to make something better for our family. I swear, I don't know what it means to work less than 70 hours a week. - thankfully I love it and my wife works with me. Sometimes we take a day off just so we can get some time way from each other!

Why is the Amercan economy heading for the dumpster? Very simply, you have to pay for it someday - and someday is coming soon. The first world standard of living is not sustainable - if everyone did so, there aren't enough resources to go around. Unfortunately, China and India (just to name the big ones) wish to. So, more people are going for the same resources - and the pockets of those in the USA are empty, or actually in the red.

Not a pretty picture. We in the USA tend to be isolationist when it comes to economy. We think that we can be however we wish - and the rest of the world will make due I suppose. Now it is happening that the rest of the world is wanting our standard of living and they have the same skills but much lower costs.

Just as businesses compete - so do countries. The USA has set itself up to be uncompetitive in the future in my opinion.

$100 shit, i never got that much

I feel its about balance.

some will NEVER have enough left over for investment.

The last thing you want to do is save all your life then die (or have your spouse die) (happened to my grandfather) just when you're at an age to start enjoying it.

I'm about to spend quite a bit on a piece of totally unessecary entertainment. and i feel bad about it, but then i think, shit, treat yourself!

either side of the midpoint is bad.

a treat every now and then feels like a treat. do it every day and it looses its worth.


work to live, not live to work.

Don't worry Steve, I have my toys alright - it is just they all end up making money eventually - or breaking even.

For example, I have a very nice Cannondale F900 hardtail mountain bike - disc brakes and everything - it was 2,000 dollars. But, it has 10,000 kilometers at least on it because I ride alot, and often just to get between our home and the office. The amount I saved on fuel and car expenses is incredible.

But for me, there is no luxury greater than financial freedom. Knowing that if I don't want to, I don't have to work today, tomorrow, or forever is a wonderful thing. Therefore, I work at what I want, instead of being a slave to my bills.

But, the most fun I have is doing research for yet another idea - and then I have enough people to get the idea done. While they are finishing the work on the idea, I start the next one - unless of course the fish are biting.

Warren Buffet said you are wealthy when every morning you wake up and do what you want. I have been wealthy most of my life based on that definition. Warren Buffet who is very rich still works because he likes it.

The key of course is brainwashing yourself into liking to work.

Make interest rates like 200% then people will only buy what they can afford. That will stop a lot a waste. Heck it would stop the stock market now that half the investments are backed by debt. I have a friend who gets a $10,000/year raise. What does he do? Pay off debt? NO! He borrows more so that he now has another $10,000 per year in debt payments.

:singing madana: Liv-ing in a material world and....

The fact is no one is going to change because they only care about them selves. Many do not care if their great grand children can live in the world we live behind. The way I see things is that it is the age of the corporation and most people really buy in all the way. We are trained from birth to want more and more and be consumers. Who can complete this song..
See...You bought it didn't you?

All we can do is examine our selves and change what we can. As one of several examples: I am putting in a cool tube system that will heat and cool my home for almost free. Getting rid of the air conditioner and resistive heat. Now I will no longer be consuming $250 worth of power just to stat comfortable.

GE spent more money a few years back researching why their motors and other things last longer than the warranty that they spent on research! Now guess what? AC motors have had a HUGE failure rate and their capacitors blow out with the smallest power surge. BUT HEY! no problem you can just buy another one! I mean why put ball bearings in that cost $2 and keep the motor running for 50 years when you can sell a 7 year motor and make seven times more money? Why use a Tesla style light bulb that never burns out when you can make one that needs replacing every year or two...

What a bunch of bologna...

Well I'm rambling on so I had better quit...

days of cheap motors are fast dissapearing here.................

MEPS ratings (Minimum Electrical Performance) are getting tougher and applying to smaller motors. I think as of this year domestic Aircon must meet a MEPS (translates into COP) of 3.05:1

Ie 1Kw in 3.05Kw cooling output.

couple this with HUGE (8k?) rebates from the gov. for solar installs that pumps buack into the grid and i think we've realised that our current electrical production/distribution grid is gonna be in trouble keeping up with demand

I'm not sure that 200% rates would do the trick. And, the "system" is not going to do that because it would mean people would quit consuming. The net effect of that would be to displace $$$ from the haves and put more in the pockets of the have nots (assuming they quit spending).

Until we decide we don't have to spend every penny we make and the toys have less value than leaving the "resources" buried in the earth, things won't change. Or, actually, we won't have control over the change. Change is inevitable, it's just what it looks like we don't know. Will it be more wars as we start fighting over the remaining resources? Will it be instability in our weather and ecosystems as we continue to pollute? Will it be the fall of those in power and the rise of new powers?

Personally, I prefer to be part of the solution - finding ways to buy less and throw away less; finding ways to survive that don't rely on articles of food, clothing or other items that have traveled thousands of mile to land on my doorstep. It's a huge change and it requires constant vigilance. It's a learning process but it's fun and challenging and at the end of the day, it helps me feel good about who I am.

I have been looking at how my family lives and am starting to see how we are made consumers. It is very feasible to change our life style and have the same amount of free money yet only require 25% of our current income. That means I can work 3 months out of the year and maintain our free money yet actually have time to live a real life, no consumer, life. One part of that is producing most all own food. Which, we are in the process of doing with AP. We only buy organic food so its expensive. Getting rid of the electric and food bills along with all our debt is a huge step towards where we want to go and because we already own our home we should be able to do it this year. My goal in 4 years is to no longer be a consumer. Picture this. 2 acres of corn are grown and processed into fuel for our cars the remaining protein we feed fish which feed plants, both of which feed us in our off the grid ground cooled/heated home. Now take that a step further and do 20 acres of corn and sell the fuel by contract and we no longer require a job to make money. :daydreams:

I like it...

Nice Dan D.. Very nice.

We would like to do something similar, though we know we will never be totally self sufficiant.

We made a decision when we moved into this place that because of the size of the block, 1.25 acres, we would try and have "something" coming from the garden all the time. We are limited by the fact that we are on a slope and have quite a bit of native vegetation around, but we probably have more available space then most of the people in "normal" suburban blocks.

The watering restriction have effected us somewhat in that our berries haven't really been very productive this year but our fruit and nut trees and vegetables have been OK because of the rainwater we harvest. Growing my own hops for beer production, chooks for eggs, and now fish ..

"Green acres is the place to be",

We saved for this place, while not doing without such necessities as a decent education for our son, Holidays for mental health, and decent modes of transportation for all.

Our next goal is to knock down the house and rebuild with one that actually takes advantage of the block we are on, basically our lounge looks into the hill face, instead of looking down the gully to the ocean. In the mean time there are any number of smaller project to take care off, retaining walls etc..

H.

...farm livin' is the life for me...