Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

I love this place.

I feel like SuperVeg needs to stop cherry picking the pieces he debates. Have you looked up the triangle shirtwaist company?

I agree. I made my point. You can take it or leave it.

You say that you are doing something by debating. If you are doing it somewhere else in an organized and targeted fashion....then good for you. If you mean you are doing something by expressing unsolicited comment here, then personally think you need to reconsider your approach to contributing.

To me this whole exercise is still just a big complaint thread with no impact or value. I once had the same opinions as you regarding voting and the vigor with which I took on any argument or "debate". I feel I have wised up. You can consider this as constructive criticism and an encouragement to air your views with effectiveness and impact in the appropriate forum, or you can continue to claim that you are doing this by not voting and provoking argument between anonymous peers. It's up to you, but I feel his conversation is reaching the point of diminishing returns... Im out.

Yes you do. How can you possibly say that. There are a whole host of responsibilities that you have as a person and as a citizen, voting is one of them. Democracies are based on the actions of the people. One of the biggest problems that we have as a society is that we do not hold our politicians to account. Many people have a similar attitude to voting to you and that is why we have the politicians we have. If more of the populous was actually involved in the political process rather than whining about it we would have a better government. It is the apathy of the population that is essentially giving us the governments we deserve.



This is just utter ridiculous. If someone doesn't want a government then they need to be a hermit. All groups of people no matter how small (2 or more) have some form of leadership structure and decision making process.

If you truly want to do away with a government start an end government party and get on with gathering the numbers to your cause. Good luck trying to organise said party without having any form of governing structures in place.

It seems Stuart and my trains of argument are start to converge

Also in the last sentence of my last post "his conversation" should be "this conversation". I'm not laying responsibility entirely on SV.

what am i cherry picking?

what about it?

Wrong, voting for the "lesser of two fools" is why we have such fools !
There are times when good politicians manage to make it through the soul-destroying political process unscathed and run for election, but very rarely. And when all the mainstream media supports the status quo it makes it very difficult for anyone wishing to make REAL changes to get their word out.


Our "duty" are you serious? What duty do I have to a gang of thieves ?
Do you work for the government or are you just a statist ?
Not partaking in the facade of voting is part (a small part) of the solution in my opinion.
If you believed in individual liberty (which you clearly do not) then you would be happy with my decision. But I you want to FORCE me to do what you think is right.



A hermit is still forced to to pay tax, your point is moot.
Yes a totally decentralised "leadership" of peoples preferences... the free market. Much more effective and efficient than a huge and bloated government that wastes everyones money.
I think you will find that when the current economic disaster unwinds itself many many more people will be questioning the legitimacy of the current state, and wondering how it all could have possibly gone so wrong when our all knowing and all powerful leaders have no clue whatsoever what is going on.

If good, intelligent, talented people don't vi for public office then bad, foolish incompetant people will and it is the fault of the good, intelligent, talented people for letting it happen.

I have no interest or desire in debating with someone who apparently pays so little attention to my posts. I started off thinking that are views on economics might not be that far apart but it seems that is not the case.

I'm out

Things are allways at change, but "your ideas" or the things "you" would like to se changed, might not have changed.
There can be several reasons for that, probably a general lack of interest/importance on the matters, would be.
Or the ideas pose a potential threat, or such a radical change (in peoples minds), so its therby rejected.

If you strongly belive in these needed changes, I suggest you join a political party (or start one).
Thats how you bring about, political changes in a civilaised way, and it does work.
Look at the policy changes around you, they don't just hapen, they are brought about, by people.


A good reason to compromise principles, is to achive results, like "making changes".
I sense that you are more anoid with laws and regulations rather than politic itselfe ?

Politic is policy making http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Policy





You live in AU ? In the Outbacks there would be zero govt influence on you, of any practical character ?
And if you don't work, there would be no tax imposed on you?

THIS IS WHERE I LOOSE YOU OR DON'T UNDERSTAND NOTHING
QUOTE: SV

I could vote with my feet. (This was the reason the US constitution put so much emphasis on little federal power and more state power, people can easily move)

How did your voting feet get this importante role ?

cheers

I am sorry you feel this way. Did I not respond to some of your posts? I apologise if this is the case, there are so many people posting on this forum. There are several other posts I would still like to respond to but I only get so much time...
I appreciate the fact you are willing to debate issues, and I respect yours and everyone's opinion.
Please don't confuse my disagreement with your opinion as not paying attention to your posts.

Yes quite interesting link thanks

cheers

This thread really has turned into a bit of a joke, it's not a reasonable debate or discussion. It started badly and I can see that it's only going to end even worse..

Might I suggest it's abandoned before someone gets poked in the eye...

And SV, please think twice before posting offensive things like at the start of this thread.

I never meant for anyone to be offended. I apologise to any who are offended.
The first post is about environmentalism in the US and to a lesser degree here.
It shows the views of todays modern totalitarian socialists.
If anyone is offended then maybe they thought they were environmentalists but are actually conservationists ?
You could perhaps look the the references to Heilbroner and check it out.
Why do we need to "decide" if this thread is "finished"
When people stop posting then it's finished, if people still want to post then it isn't I suppose...
There are plenty of other threads in this forum that have much less user participation, and are far less useful and informative to the readers..

No...... Rubbish, it's name calling...

It's the method by which these goals are to be obtained that is the issue.
Do you seriously believe that the environmentalist movment is not a totalitarian socialist one?
What is your opinion on this ?