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Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
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Author:  aza_500 [ Dec 9th, '16, 19:53 ]
Post subject:  Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
Hay guys,

I want to start this by saying a big thank you to all the people who write comments on this forum, it has been super helpful in my build and i have spent hours apon hours reading peoples advice on here!

Now to business, i have just completed a build at my house. Which i would love some feedback on and any advice would be a great help.

The pond is made from 300x500x100mm limestone blocks and a thick concrete slab. I than sealed it with Crommelins Pond Sealer which the 1st 3 layers where watered down and than 3 that were normal viscosity.

The grow beds i wanted to look clean and match the existing garden. I ended up using Panel and Post retaining systems with pond liner wedged in between the bottom and top layer. Than used H3 pine to make frame work to hold the preformed ponds which were filled with media and now have 50% sunshade over the top.

I also thought it would be a good idea to add a Pressure Filter into the system. It is plumbed up so that the pond can run independently if needed or supply to the grow beds.

Once completed i flushed the system 3 times (once due to a pump error). I let the system run for about 9 days before adding plants and a day later i bought 10 Barramundi which are about 200 grams each.

This now catches me up to present time and am looking forward to seeing what happens and learning as much as i can.

Thanks for reading :)

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Author:  skeggley [ Dec 10th, '16, 06:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
Hiya aza, welcome to the forum.
Your build looks really neat and tidy, well done, thanks for sharing.
Have you got a test kit for the water parameters? In this weather it shouldn't take too long to cycle but you'll need to keep an eye on the ammonia levels.
I've not tried barramundi it'll be interesting to see how they go here in Perth.
Author:  dlf_perth [ Dec 10th, '16, 08:52 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
Hi Aza, welcome to the forum.

Looks like you have a fairly long pipe run there - how far are the grow beds away from the pond ?

+1 to Greg (Skeggley) about the API freshwater test kit and taking regular readings for temp, pH, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Especially while the system is getting settled.

couple questions on aeration and system operation
(a) what are you doing for aeration
(b) how are you running the system and the water circulation (perhaps an explanation)

would be good to get an idea of your volumes as well as they will factor in to future feedback.

have you added any salt for the fish at this time ?
Author:  aza_500 [ Dec 10th, '16, 10:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
[quote="skeggley"]Hiya aza, welcome to the forum.
Your build looks really neat and tidy, well done, thanks for sharing.
Have you got a test kit for the water parameters? In this weather it shouldn't take too long to cycle but you'll need to keep an eye on the ammonia levels.


Yeh i bought one, at this point all levels are good. The P.H is at 8 which is normal for a new system apparently :) Had one Barra die in transport unfortunetely though :(
Author:  aza_500 [ Dec 10th, '16, 10:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
dlf_perth wrote:
Hi Aza, welcome to the forum.

Looks like you have a fairly long pipe run there - how far are the grow beds away from the pond ?

+1 to Greg (Skeggley) about the API freshwater test kit and taking regular readings for temp, pH, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Especially while the system is getting settled.

couple questions on aeration and system operation
(a) what are you doing for aeration
(b) how are you running the system and the water circulation (perhaps an explanation)

would be good to get an idea of your volumes as well as they will factor in to future feedback.

have you added any salt for the fish at this time ?





Hay mate.
The pond to grow beds are about 9 meters. I use the two of the same 5000 L/H pumps to go from pond to sump.

As for aeration in the pond i have 4 sources
1- the pump going to growbeds is Tee'd off and goes to the top of pond shooting water down (Venturi) also has a Ball valve to control flow.
2-Basically the same as the first except its the return line from the sump.
3 and 4- 30cm air stone and a 10cm air pad.

The system is a 2 pump system (which has been tricky to keep water levels constant) I have about 2000L of water in the pond and about 600L of grow bed at this time. As i have made it to be expanded as the funds allow. Soon i will probably add 6m of NFT system.

I did not know you had to add salt for the Barra?? as i thought they mainly stay in freshwater and head for the salt for spawning?

thanks
Author:  Mr Damage [ Dec 10th, '16, 13:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
aza_500 wrote:
I did not know you had to add salt for the Barra?? as i thought they mainly stay in freshwater and head for the salt for spawning?

thanks
Hey Aza,

The salt does two things. It helps the fish maintain their protective slime coat, but more importantly, as you're cycling with fish in the system, it helps mitigate the harmful effect of the Nitrite spike you will get about 2-3 weeks after adding your fish.

One part per thousand is sufficient for both reasons. So 1gm of sea salt (pool salt) per litre of water. 1ppt is not detrimental to your plants and it will dissipate over a few months. It's actually recommended, for best results with barra, that the salt level be maintained at around 1ppt at all times. Most people don't bother with this maintenance level and still get good results. If you do want to do it, you can monitor the salt level with a salinity refractometer, they're available off ebay for about $40

Quote:
Yeh i bought one, at this point all levels are good.
As the others have alluded to, what are your Ammonia and Nitrite levels?... Also, what is your water temp?... At this point in the cycling process your system could be entering a very dangerous stage for the fish, so it's important to monitor these levels, especially in warmer weather and with high water pH.

Cheers!
Author:  Mel Redcap [ Dec 10th, '16, 13:48 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
Welcome to the forum Aza!

A little bit of salt in the water protects fish from nitrite spikes, keeps fungus down and also supports them against bacterial infections; a lot of people run with about 1 part per thousand all the time, and bump it up to 3ppt if they're dealing with any illnesses or quarantining new fish. You can also use higher levels for a short term salt bath when you're adding new fish to the system and want to make sure they're not carrying parasites etc, or for treating disease outbreaks. Most plants do fine with a little salt in the water, though strawberries are really sensitive to it.

If you decide you want to salt your water, you can get pool salt from Bunnings or pool supply places - it's the same as table salt, but it doesn't have anti-caking agents and iodine added, and it's also a lot cheaper to buy in bulk! For a 2000L system you'd use 2kg of salt to bring it up to 1ppt.

(Mr Damage beat me! :laughing3: )
Author:  aza_500 [ Dec 11th, '16, 14:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
thanks[/quote]Hey Aza,

The salt does two things. It helps the fish maintain their protective slime coat, but more importantly, as you're cycling with fish in the system, it helps mitigate the harmful effect of the Nitrite spike you will get about 2-3 weeks after adding your fish.

One part per thousand is sufficient for both reasons. So 1gm of sea salt (pool salt) per litre of water. 1ppt is not detrimental to your plants and it will dissipate over a few months. It's actually recommended, for best results with barra, that the salt level be maintained at around 1ppt at all times. Most people don't bother with this maintenance level and still get good results. If you do want to do it, you can monitor the salt level with a salinity refractometer, they're available off ebay for about $40

Quote:
Yeh i bought one, at this point all levels are good.
As the others have alluded to, what are your Ammonia and Nitrite levels?... Also, what is your water temp?... At this point in the cycling process your system could be entering a very dangerous stage for the fish, so it's important to monitor these levels, especially in warmer weather and with high water pH.

Cheers![/quote]

Thanks for the info, i have added the 2kg of salt and will look at buying the refractometer. The levels at this time are;
PH - 8
Ammonia - between 0 and .25 on colour chart
Phosphate - 0
Nitrite - between 0 and .25 on the colour chart
Temperature - 24 degrees C

Also is it uncommon for freshly transported Barra to be very still and not move much? They seem to have paired up or small groups and sit in one spot for hours.

I also managed to break 3 of the 4 test vials :( so great start on that one.
Author:  Tonzz [ Dec 11th, '16, 15:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
glass vials....I got some from local chemist worth a try
Author:  aza_500 [ Dec 11th, '16, 16:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
Awsome ill give the chemist ago than :)

On another thought has anyone ever tried heating a outdoor aquaponics setup in Perth???
I think i could keep my pond and sump covered with Coolroom insulating. Than not sure about the actual heating side. to use black pvc pipe and run onto the roof for solar heating or a powerful aquarium heater??

thanks
Author:  dlf_perth [ Dec 11th, '16, 17:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
check price in chemist otherwise eBay has heaps. Just need to make sure you get same volume as the size is critical fr the number of drops and the water mark etc. required to b accurate for the test process.

problem with roof top heating would be controlling it. Presumably it would be off line in summer and mainly for autumn and winter. Also you would presumably have to have a diversion option for the water when you don't want to use it. And then the size of pump required. Would be easier to build a greenhouse/glass house.
Author:  roddo [ Dec 11th, '16, 20:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
Im in the process of adding heating for my system im using the black pool heating on the roof i am plumbing it so i turn a valve and it diverts to the roof for heating then into the fish tanks or change the valve and it diverts past the heating and just pumps into the fish tanks for extra oxygen and water tutnover. I can open the valves partly or fully to regulate the temp. Might be able to get 3-4 extra months of growing the barra but i doubt it will be enough to push through the winter.
Author:  aza_500 [ Dec 14th, '16, 17:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
NEED SOME ADVICE
Today checked my levels

I have a PH that is 5.0 and my ammonia is up between .5 and 1

is this worth worrying about? or good to be proactive now?

I currently have 9 Barra which are not feeding. I have had them for 5 days now. I have read they are normally estactic to get food and go straight for it. At this the food floats around for ages and they stay in the corners. Because of this i have only been putting a pinch of food in twice a day. They are about 20cm each and 200 grams

Also have 600L of grow beds with seedlings in them.

thanks guys
Author:  dlf_perth [ Dec 14th, '16, 22:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
>> I have a PH that is 5.0 and my ammonia is up between .5 and 1

Have you cycled your system properly ?
Sounds like - no. In which case you are going to have some problems.
if not sure then read this thread... >> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28000
pretty much takes you through the path you will have to go down (over 3 pages and 4 weeks of posts).

can you double check your pH ? Are you using rainwater or scheme (mains) water ?
6 would be common if using rainwater and unsettled system but bit harder to drop lower.
sh&t starts hitting the fan at those levels.... that pH is well outside fish comfort levels.


most likely you will need to do water changes but you have to be very careful as any sudden change will kill your fish.
Doing nothing with those levels will put fish at risk as well.

BTW - are you using the proper API test tubes ? The water volume to the marked line is critical else you will get false/wrong readings.
Author:  dlf_perth [ Dec 15th, '16, 08:44 ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Build in Metro W.A --- also a hello
>> sh&t starts hitting the fan at those levels.... that pH is well outside fish comfort levels.

and nitrification ceases to occur, so the system will tumble further pretty quickly.
really important to double check the pH. A sudden drop is often associated with ammonia/nitrite issues.

as above water changes will probably be required...but you have to do it gradually/carefully.
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