Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Following on from the issues I had with high temperatures...
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I believe I have a new problem... I found that the kois have loss some of their scales... Noticed it first on the struggling koi and was puzzled at why its body was smooth and without scales... and the back part of its tail seems stucked or rigid... it appears it only has control of its body to mid-body... the back part is like a stick... weird.. the rest of the kois are swimming around fine...

I did a google and found that it could be Myxosporidiosis based on the scale losing. Appears to be a parasite... Did not notice this on the previous dead fishes so this must be an opportunistic parasite attacking temperature stressed fishes...

According to some website, water changes is the only way of getting rid of these parasites... I did about
50% water change today and salted to 3ppt... Pump is running constantly now...

Also added some yabbies in the sump before I found out about this... hopefully the parasites do not attack yabbies.

Well anyway it is all just a possible hunch, but I suppose I have done all I could for now... maybe do another water change this Thursday/Friday...

I also had shell grit in the tank before which I just pour it without any netting ... maybe the shells cause some of the scales to fall off when the fishes swam about but it has been there for months already... and did not notice any lost scales from the earlier fishes that possibly died from high temperature...

I also noticed that the struggling koi today seems to have one damaged eye now... I think the photo attached from yesterday may have already shown signs of being damaged... left eye...

Other things that I have added recently were some batu wood decking onto top of the fish and sump tank with shade cloth attached... I did not seal the wood fearing that it could add toxins into the water, so I left it as I bought it from Bunnings... some of the wood may have come into contact with tank water on some occasions... Could it have leech toxins into the tank???

Any other ideas what it might be??

just a thought your problems dident start after adding the yabbies

Well from memory, I believe the problems were there before adding the yabbies... ie.. fish acting weird and all..

and I probably should add that the yabbies are in the sump... different tank...

Many of my Koi have bare skin in places, they always have had. I never realised until I treated them that it wasn't just small scales, the scales acrually don't exist. Makes them particularly succeptable to aerosomonas which comes up as ulcers.

I would think your fish has a paralysing disease.

only help I could find suggested:

#1 cause .. vitamin C deficiency
#2 cause ... nutrient deficiency
#3 cause .. genetic problem
# 25 ... stray electrical current

I've seen this a lot. I currently have a zebra danio with the same problem. He's been in the work FT for 2 years now like that... he's fine. They wont recover, but should not suffer too much.

ther is a koi called a 'Sue Swe' (i think thats the name of it and i doubt i spelt it right!) but they dont have scales, and some of the Koi we get from pet shops these days are crosses of these so thats where the patches of missing scales come from i think allong with the defined ridge of scales down the back, scholiosis is comon in fish and i belive caused by nutrition deficiancy at a young age.

Well I have been feeding them the same food I feed the barra... Skretting Spectra... in smaller quantities...
I believe they were all fine, before the heat wave hit... So it is probably more disease related than genetics...

I doubt the struggling koi will get pass this weekend... he was on his side when I visited the tank this morning...

Any comments on the possibility of the batu wood leeching toxins into the tank??

wood is often toxic... but if dried well, it shouldn't be a problem. I put drift wood into my tanks all the time. They release tannins and turn the water black, but I've never lost a fish over it.

genetics can be a problem with a poor batch of fish from inter breading for exampl that will not do well and will never reach there potential but will survive for some time.

batu decking is often sealed with decking oil and that would caus you a problem if it ends up in your tank, i have left some decking out on the lime stone paving and after a shower ther was quit a stain that took some time to get rid off.

I suppose I did not really buy the good quality kois... so maybe they aren't as resilient as some of the better breed ones...

I would have thought that the batu decking you buy from bunnings are not sealed with decking oil yet... sawing through the wood, it appears to be one complete colour... I would assume sealed wood would show two colours since the oil would not entirely penetrate the wood... although I would say that they do leech some colour into water... like what KP mentioned... tannins...

Well so far the fishes are still okay, although we have a heat wave coming this weekend which could take them out...

Well two more kois died today... Only took the picture for one of them since I threw the other straight into the bin...

Noticed the missing scales, bent (arch) upwards tail fin, bloody fins...

I only noticed the bent upwards tail fin in kois that aren't doing so well already... I think they are bent because they have been struggling to keep themselves stable in the water...

Not sure about the cause, unless it is the temperature fluctuations that is knocking them out...

It might be a little late to test, but can you "unbend" the tail and tell if it is muscular or the spine itelf?

Mark

Yeah... it's too late... I have put it in the garden bin... it is actually dried now... since we have air temperature of about 44degC...

This looks a bit like it

Scoliosis:
Scoliosis is caused by a variety of conditions, none of which is infectious. The most common cause of scoliosis is Vitamin C deficiency. But there are 3 other causes. 2) Tryptophan deficiency: An amino acid protein building block that may be absent in foods due to improper formulation, hyper extended storage, excess heat in processing, or because no variation was permitted in the diet. To avoid this, always use two different high qualtiy staple diets, and supplement periodically with earthworms or other bait worms. Mealworms and crickets may also be accepted, especially if partially crushed. 3) Trauma: The muscles of Koi and other teleost fish are assorted in bands called 'somites'. When a somite is damaged, by intra Muscular injection technique, for example, or a sharp blow, the somite may die, which then shrinks, and kinks the fish, especially when swimming. It may straighten at rest. 4) Organophosphates, like Fenthion, Trichlorfon, or Malathion to name but a few, can cause kinking of the body due to hyper contraction of the muscles. (A side effect of these drugs on the fish is to prevent relaxtion of muscles) and this may kink, or break the fishes back.

Vitamin C deficiencies may be avoided by feeding a varied diet to include the following greens: Spinach, Turnip greens, Broccoli heads, and Dark leaf lettuce. NOT PLAIN LETTUCE!!! Additionally, store no food longer than 90 days, and be sure the label has added ASCORBIC acid. Once scoliosis is noted, the fish is better removed to fresh water, and better attention to diet is advised. As a side note, the biggest, fastest growing fish are most likely to kink, as they need the most Vitamin C and calcium in their diet, to support their rapid growth.

reprinted from 1994 AKCA Seminar Binder
John

My mistake, the bent spine I referred to was bent sideways. I've never seen such a deformity as in your photo before.