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| A sustainable fish http://byap.backyardmagazines.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8107 |
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| Author: | moekuc [ Aug 29th, '10, 18:05 ] |
| Post subject: | A sustainable fish |
Hi guys, As much as I like the fact that silvers, jades, barra, are all Australian and are good eating, they are too difficult to breed for the home aquaponicer so they aren't really sustainable... im talking long term. When oil prices keep going up, and it costs more to ship the fish then they are worth, they how are you going to get fingerlings delivered? Trout has the same issue. Tilapia will just keep breeding, and i.e. carp can breed pretty easily. So it either going to be fish farms in cities, or closer to cities, we live out of cities or we have to allow i.e. tilapia for the aqua cultural purposes. what are your thoughts on this? |
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| Author: | earthbound [ Aug 29th, '10, 18:10 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
Unfortunately it doesn't really matter what we think about it because fish like Carp and Tilapia are on noxious lists and we can't use them, not without facing huge fines.. I hope that this might change, I would love to try carp in a system, but I figure I'll have to move to another country to try them... 
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| Author: | mantis [ Aug 29th, '10, 18:18 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
I think its crap also, and our rivers and lakes are full of redfin and carp so der. why not let us have a fish that we can harvest, breed and well......................... |
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| Author: | moekuc [ Aug 29th, '10, 18:24 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
i really think that once fish like tilapia or carp get established they won't really get taken out completely. i kind of think its "too late" and the harm is already done so we might as well have the option... not that im against the rationale, im all for protecting natives. But having a fish population that you can replenish locally seems more sustainable long term. |
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| Author: | earthbound [ Aug 29th, '10, 18:31 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
I think here in W.A. we were the only state to not have Tilapia on the noxious list, but a couple of months ago they were added and the following is what you face: Quote: It should be noted that there are penalties for possession, importation, or translocation of noxious fish into and within WA, with fines up to $10,000 for a first offence. Dumping of live non-endemic fish may attract similar fines.
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| Author: | RupertofOZ [ Aug 29th, '10, 18:56 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
All our native fish are sustainable.... unless they face competition from imported species... like Tilapia, Carp... and to some lesser extent Redfin... 
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| Author: | moekuc [ Aug 30th, '10, 13:10 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
how are you going to breed silver perch or barra though? |
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| Author: | earthbound [ Aug 30th, '10, 14:40 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
I guess you leave that to the people who know how. As with many areas, like fixing electrical items, you get in someone with experience rather than giving it a bash yourself. As demand for fish increases, more people with the equipment and knowledge will produce the fish to fill the market. I know of at least three people that have started breeding silvers in the last couple of years because there is more of a market. Small local producers is the way to go if we can;t get simple fish that will breed themselves. |
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| Author: | RupertofOZ [ Aug 30th, '10, 21:24 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
moekuc wrote: Tilapia will just keep breeding, and i.e. carp can breed pretty easily. And there in lies the problem.... what happens when a home aquaponicist.... ends up with too many Tilapia or Carp fingerlings.... does he flush them down the drain... or release them into the local waterway.... That's pretty much how we ended up with them in some of our waterways.... and that is not a "sustainable" practice... Even if fingerling prices were to rise due to increased electricity and water prices... so would general food prices... and the price of fish... Relatively, buying fingerlings and raising them in your backyard system... will still be cheaper than buying fish at a retail outlet... |
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| Author: | Boris01 [ Aug 30th, '10, 21:36 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
I like eating apples, but when all hell breaks loose and fuel prices push up the price of apples, how will I ever be able to pay for apples ?! which type of apple tree do I need to have ( and how many ) to have apples still when the global financial apocalypse happens ? a while ago I think I figured out all-up the fish I eat from the yard ( at eating size ) cost me under $7 a kilo I reckon fuel prices are gonna have to push fingerling prices up a HUGE amount to make it to be cheaper for me to buy eating size fish from the supermarket ( which I guarantee , regardless of fuel costs, will STILL be bloody imported ) gonna grow your own wheat to make bread aswell ? |
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| Author: | moekuc [ Aug 30th, '10, 23:13 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
And there in lies the problem.... what happens when a home aquaponicist.... ends up with too many Tilapia or Carp fingerlings.... does he flush them down the drain... or release them into the local waterway....>> then your really just adding fish that are already there. not that im saying I would, but yeah i see what you mean, there is the idiot who would ruin it for everyone. I really think fish like carp are here to stay though. How are you going to get into through the entire murray darling and catch all of them? it seems pretty impossible. Water I can catch from my roof, electricity i could power the AP with some solar/wind seeds i can save from every harvest but if i cant breed the fish or get them for a reasonable price, what do you do? |
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| Author: | RupertofOZ [ Aug 30th, '10, 23:22 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
New season fingerlings sell from $0.65 - $1.20.... you pay about that much for sardines in a can... |
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| Author: | Boris01 [ Aug 31st, '10, 00:51 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
"adding fish that are already there" ?? I let out a pack of wild hungry lions into a nightclub once, but its ok cause there were already some there, so I was really only just adding lions that were already there ... You can't breed cows in a city either. chickens I suppose , but the neighbours would have a fit . looks like not EVERY source of food can be scaled down to fit neatly and productively in a suburban backyard , who woulda thunk it ! |
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| Author: | caribis [ Aug 31st, '10, 03:30 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
I wouldn't worry too much about the cost of fingerling delivery. It may rise, but food prices will outpace the rise making your aquaponics raised fish even more of a deal. Oil has a natural price ceiling. There are substitutes. If/when oil is replaced as the primary transportation fuel it will occur over time. Sustained high transportation fuel prices will guarantee the investment market required for the substitutes. As much as I would like to see the collapse of civilization for my own selfish reasons posting.php?mode=reply&f=2&t=8107&sid=9b0c992a89d57ae1e8ce4d6b35199edf# , it is highly unlikely to occur because of oil prices. Problems in the developing world like affordable water, food prices and the creation of a general purpose assembly robot dislocating hundreds of millions of workers should keep you up late at night long before the price of oil for use as a transportation fuel. Unfortunately, unlike terrestrial animals, fish use the 'flood the world with young, a few will survive' philosophy of reproduction. This does make it more difficult to breed a few, like you could do with foul or mammals. As long as there is demand, there will be somebody breeding fish for sale as fingerlings. Encourage your neighbors to take up aquaponics, and you'll do your part to raise fingerling demand. |
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| Author: | moekuc [ Aug 31st, '10, 08:36 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A sustainable fish |
I let out a pack of wild hungry lions into a nightclub once, but its ok cause there were already some there, so I was really only just adding lions that were already there >> If there was fish already in the river, and you add more, how much more of an issue are they? it couldn't be that much surely, i mean one person for many thousand that would actually go and chuck their fish in the river. Theres no point in doing an noxious list if you don't have a comprehensive eradication program as well. Its strange because in the US you can breed Tilapia even though there are a problem in states such as Florida. Because its good for farming, it is accepted that you can have them. Oh and cant you keep Koi in NSW? Koi are basically carp. Also we can keep rabbits, rats, camels, etc as pets/otherwise even though they are a pest in many parts of oz. |
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