Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

They're still legal in WA Sleepe.

The problem isn't with the "Greens" as such, its more with certain sections of the fisheries dept and other govt depts like the EPA. Basically neither seem willing to allow any new fish species into the state regardless of the proposal. There is however pressure on fisheries by environmentalist groups to stop introducing Trout into public waters and these same groups are also very anti any new fish species being allowed into the state.
The problem with the fisheries dept is that each section has different views on the subject which is why there is always conflicting answers given out to the general public. If you speak to someone involved in the aquaculture dept you generally get favorable answers. When I asked them about Jades they couldnt see a problem with my proposal and the guy even encouraged me to try for Murray Cod!! Speak to someone in bio security section and they will tell you all you should be able to keep is native Minnows & Pigmy Perch and that allowing Trout & Silver Perch into the state was a big mistake.

Do they give reason Gav? Id really, really like to know why the aquarium trade has got a free pass and backyard aquaculture/aquaponics doesnt?

In a nut shell that is what I asked the fisheries recently and a few times in the past. Im happy to lay it to rest if we get a reasonable answer. I just dont see the difference. It doesnt make sense.

I want, (and Im sure most others) would like to sleep well that we are doing everything by the book. If I can have a noxious species in my lounge room aquarium but not in a larger version in my backyard... well...WHY?... Im just left confused.

I havnt heard back from fisheries and to be honest I dont really expect to.

I tend to be short in my comments ( and occasionally a little cryptic).
I was a Federal public servant for 25 years. I have also fought bureaucracy and the pollies for a number of years
You don't get change by giving bureaucrats hassles,(just get your proven facts in writing) you get the pollies onside and then compromise on the terms of what you want to do ie they look good and you get what you want.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-GkwIRbLw8

Noxious species aren't allowed in aquariums Charlie.
You are not allowed to keep tilapia in them.
Jade and MC are not declared species.
IMO, the difference between AP and ornamental is that ornamental keepers don't ask permission first...

It seems to be a cost thing, in their opinion having access to lets say Murray Cod in an pet shop would cost someone at least $10 per fish where as the same fish from a breeder may be $1.00. Its therefore (in fisheries opinion) less likely that someone will go out and buy 100 Cod and stick them in a river if there paying $10 ea rather than $1 ea.



Yeah they wont bother writing back to you thats why its best to phone them as they have to answer your questions then. I disagree with Sleepe here in that I have found the only way to get results from public servants is to keep hassling them.



Good point, the other species are out there and available if you really want to try them just means you will have to pay a bit more for them. I have seen plenty of Jades & Golden Perch, Murray & Sleepy Cod and Tandanus Tandanus in peoples aquaponics systems which have come from either pet shops or brought in from over east. The loopholes are there if you really want to try the other species. I havent seen it written anywhere that these species are illegal to keep in an aquaponics sytem so you should still be able to sleep at night Charlie if you go down that path.

Ok cool, thanks guys.

From the Fisheries website

"Invitation for public comment – open until 27 August 2012
Public comment is invited during the next 21 days on an application made pursuant to Regulation 176 (1) (b) of the Fish Resources Management Regulations 1995, for Kenneth Owen to translocate: 20 Cherax quadricarinatus (redclaw crayfish) from Kayan Road, Theebine, Queensland; and 100 Scortum barcoo ( jade perch) from Ausyfish Pty. Ltd., Childers, Queensland; to a closed aquaculture system at 10 Whelk Place, Mullaloo, Western Australia, for the purposes of commercial aquaculture."

I agree with Sleepe. Speaking from firsthand experience (from the side of a bureaucrat). If you don’t get any success with the bureaucrats you need to aim higher, higher up the bureaucratic food chain or the Minister. And do it in writing. What is said and what is written can be two completely different things. It may take several exchanges of letters to get what you want but that is a far more effective way of getting your point across than a call. If you do write don’t do it by email (even though it is supposed to be a government record) but attached your letter to the email and ask for an acknowledgement that they have received it.

Aiming at the Minister can be effective. The initial responses are often bland and wont address the issue but persist with the matter. When bureaucrats draft the Minister's response they are very careful not to be misleading as that may embarrass the Minister. (often it will be the same bureaucrat that you spoke to on the phone or wrote to that drafts the Minister’s response). If they are stupid enough to put something in that is misleading then point it out. I guarantee that you will get a reaction.

The other thing that bureaucrats wont like is an FoI request on the matter. Information that may be obtained under FoI can be used in the strategies mentioned above.

Think of it as a long game, if you play it well there is a good chance you will be successful.

In the matter regarding the introduction of new species of fish into WA, the success may be that you solidify DoF position and you no longer get mixed messages.

The Australian constitution allows for free trade between the States. However Biosecurity is a generally accepted exception. This should be risk based and justified. – That topic could take up a whole thread on its own

Thats interesting Sleepe pitty I didnt know about it earlier. Still for only 100 fish and 20 Redclaw how is that commercial? And if its commercial he must have an aquaculture licence which is going to make those fish very expensive.

Looks like someone working the system to their advantage.

Not really Arbe. Any of you guys could go down the same path but you would have to spend about $600 before you even know if your going to get approval. Then you would have to pay another $600 for health certificates and then the cost of the fish and freight. On the positive side at least you could then legally sell the fish to a restaurant but you'd be wanting about $20 each just to break even!

Troutman, sorry I only took an interest in the fisheries dept a few years ago, made a High Court case.
You don't think these might be breeding stock?

Marc, you had a few ministerials

More than my fair share Sleepe.
Unfortunately very few people know how to "work the system" to their advantage or to get the best outcome they can. Shame really.

I doubt it as they are being kept in suburban Mullaloo!! Even if he were to breed from them down the track he wont be able to legally on sell any of the fingerlings.



In my case there is no time left to "work the system" as I am expecting a written decision within the next few weeks.