Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

I am graduating from a small college in Washington State with a two year Fisheries Technology degree, I'm way too excited about AP, and I have a ton of questions
I am planning on setting up a 300 to 500 gallon tank with some beds, haven't decided is I want gravel or deep water, and trying to raise yellow perch or tilapia at fairly high density, with the idea of gaining experience to possible turn into a commercial set up someday. BUT, right now I am just dreaming big

I was looking at poly stock tanks today, sizes I found were 500, 350, 300 and 150gallon. The bigger tanks were all around $225-250 (American as it were). The stock ponds were all around a meter high, the 500 gallon tank is 8' in diameter if I recall. My other option at this point is to dig a hole and put a liner in it. Are the stock tanks deep enough for my needs? I live in a temperate rainforest on the Olympic Peninsula in Washington State, water use isn't a concern ( we get up to 200+ inches a year, we just got 3.26 inches in 24 hours last week), and we have summer temperatures getting up to the 90s but averaging 65 to 80 maybe.

I have a rough idea about the system i want, and definately could use some input. Since I don't own land but Mom and Dad do (thanks Mom and Dad) I am going to build a cedar pole frame and put some thick clear vinyl over it to make a greenhouse. Did I mention I am on a college students budget I don't know how it would last the winter, but I think it will be ok for a season at least, and the cedar fram will last until Dad gets tired of looking at it

Ok, lots of rambling there, I guess my main questions right now are should I dig a hole or get a stock tank, and with tilapia or yellow perch work well.

Oh, and I hope this is the right way to ask for answers, I'ver been reading the forum for a week and I've not caught onto to format fully

Thanks
Justin

Welcome Justin....sounds like you are well and truely on the way to AP addiction....

Anything around 1 mtr high or above is just fine for a fish tank....

Growbeds have been found by experience to require to be at least 30cm to work at the maximum efficiency.

Some DWC / floating raft systems are perhaps less than that optimum figure, but such systems usually have supplementary bio-filters and/or under-gravel filters and additional aeration to ensure they work efficiently.... more like hydroponic systems.

welcome JR... (Dalas music plays in the background)
Sounds like you have the bug
Talapia are a safe bet - tough little buggers who LIKE to breed and do so in a wide veriety of water conditions...
As for tanks, go with what you are comfortable with (me, I like them burried for a number of reasons), Same with the grow beds - I like gravel because it filters well, provides a fantastic medium for bacteria (and earth worms) and and still is a medium for plants to grow in (to a considerable height)... There has been a lot of back and forth on bed depth - take some time to read and ask the Moderators and members for assistance - information is readily given here

I love my stock tanks. My main tank is only 150 gal capacity, filled to maybe 125 with a lid. Tilapia jump. The tank is only 24" tall, but the water level is 6" down from that. So the tilapia are in 18" of water, and are just fine.

See my system here.
http://backyardaquaponics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=735

Hi JR,

I've only been at this about a cople of months longer than you so the other guys have much more experience. Exciting stuff I know how you feel.

AM
Would Tilapia be a good idea? If his green house is just a single skin and he is on a budget how are the fish going to go when it snows? W State is way up north right? Heating could get expensive.

Stuart

hmmmm... honestly did not condsider that (for a teacher my geography of the US of A is not that sharp )
WHat local fish do you have in the surrounding streams and rivers?

WOW thanks for so much help already

I am at the northwest corner of the lower 48, right up near canada, but because we are on the coast its a pretty mild climate. We get snow about once a year, rarely over a foot and it lasts for a few days to a week, BUt we get overnight frost intermittently from October through March.

Because my greenhouse will be framed with cedar poles from 8 to 10 inches in diameter, I was thinking that when fall comes I could put another layer of plastic along the inside edge of the poles and create a dead air space 6 or 8 inches thick. Heating still wouldn't be much fun because the sky is overcast at least 75% of the time between November and February.
local indigenous fish
Pacific Salmon - Chinook, Coho, Chum, Sockeye, some pinks, steelhead and rainbow trout, and cutthroat trout (Oncorhynchus clarki)

Non-native species
brook trout (Salvelinus fontinalis)
yellow perch
largemouth bass
bluegill sunfish

When the seahawks went to the superbowl (January a couple years back)I watched the game at a guy's house, and saw live tilapia in a very small pond next to his house. I know the air temps were getting near freezing at night, which means they should have been dead, I intend to look into this matter further.

SO, I think yellow perch would be fun ad delicious, but my source would probably be to catch a bucketful from a nearby lake, I think tilapia would be good practice for commercial AP, rainbow trout bore me at this point because I have fed and weighted and measured hundereds and hundreds of them over the last two years, salmon of course are anadromous, a friend has a four foot deep by twelve foot or pond in his backyard with some very big largemouth bass that he hand feeds so they do ok. OH, and I read somewhere on the forum that some people don't like crawdads?! Ours up here get pretty good sized, are quite delicious, and I could go out in an afternoon and get a half a five gallon bucketful.

I am also an avid fisherman and lisenced fishing guide in Washington and Alaska. I spearfish very often so I have lingcod and black rockfish and cabezon carcasses to grow maggots with. Oh, and I am a traditional bowhunter and a pre-apprentice falconer.

Thanks again for reading my mile long posts and offering so much advice.

Cheers,
Justin

Justin,

Welcome! To answer a couple questions, a stock tank that is aquaculture purpose built is a good way to start. 500 gallons is a good size also and what I have currently. I've had smaller tanks inthe past and consider 500g. to be a better starting point if you have the sapce and resource for a good tank.

Tank culture is rough on fish. Low DO and poor water quality are common when learning AP and trying to balance fish and growbeds. Tilapia are highly recommended as a durable fish highly tolerant to wide ranging water parameters and disease resistant. They breed easily and are edible as well. Here in California they are illegal to possess. But the pet shop sold them to me, so I have an alabi. Since Tilapia are cichlids, they can be sourced in specialty fish shops. Check around.

Cheers

Since we grew tilapia at the college 60 miles from where I will be building my system, I am sure I can find them somewhere up here. Another option I have been toying with is to set up two smaller (300 gallon) tanks, one with a DWC/raft growbed and one with a gravel grow bed. Seems like I could learn twice as much that way. any thoughts?

I think that is a great idea. You will undoubtedly learn alot. 300 gallons is still a good size to work with, plenty of buffer, however I do not recommend burying tanks if you don't have to. It's easier to work with a tanks plumbing, insulation needs, and placement at the surface. If you get the Poly Tank.... I assume you are speaking of the conical bottom or flat bottom tanks sold by PolyTank in Litchfield Minnisota?? you will be set up for a venturi drain, which is what I use for my system. http://backyardaquaponics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=504 pgs. 1,2, and 8 have photos. I couldn't justify the shipping cost on the polytanks so I went to the local ag store and purchased 500 g and 350 g plastic cistern tanks, cut the top off of them and connected side venturi drains.

You can also combine the gravel and DWC methods in one water cycle by channeling your water through the gravel first so filter the solids, then let runnoff into the DWC bed, or tank. That way you have a solids filter for the DWC which you will need.

Justin,

how big do your crawdads get? I'm very interested in crayfish. There is a lot of interest in crayfish, but since this is an Australian board, they call them "Yabbies" "Marrons" and "Redclaw" and a couple other names I don't remember.

If you could catch a gallon or so and ship them up to me in Alaska... I'd be really grateful.

Mike - So the stock tanks I saw were water tanks for cattle I guess, and like I said they were around 250$ for the 350 and 500 gallon tanks, but I am tring to figure out a way to get free or low cost tanks. There are Giant garbage cans or 'wheelie bins' if you will, in near by Port Angeles, probably 300 gallons or so and four feet high, and I might be able to hunt up a couple of those for cheap. And I think the above ground tank for access will be good, like the five tank system we have set up at the college. Of course when it gets cold and I have Tilapiacicles then I might sing a different tune. I also really like your set up. I have been cruising the 'net a lot looking for designs and from what I've seen your system looks like what I want. Once I get my greenhouse up I might stalk you (or maybe just ask for your number and call)

As for Washington State YABBIES ( I think thats my favorite, and I can't say marron, it sounds like moron when I try), the local species, found throughout the pacific northwest is 'Pacifastacus leniusculus' or 'signal crawfish' which according to the internet grow up to 15 cm in length. NOt sure how long it takes them to get that big, but I did find some information that said people prefer the taste of our crawdads to the species found down south and back east. As for shipping some up, once the water warms up and they come out in force I'm sure I could round some up, but I'm not sure how to go about shipping live yabbies that like cold water.

thanks
Justin

A note to anyone interested, I am clearing out my greenhouse location, and as it turns out, 1991 mazda extended cab pickups work great for flattening 10 foot high patches of evergreen and himalaya blackberries
Am going out now to continue the war against the brambles..

go forth young man!

the blackberries have fallen, and so has the old chicken coop, in their place is now a small pile of black ashes. Today before I go catch a springer (thats spring run c hinook salmon) from the Sol Duc River a stone's throw from where I am sitting now, I will have a fram up for my greenhouse YAY!