Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Wow, Stevo. What an ordeal!

On the assumption that you de-chlorinated the water, the bacteria levels will be fine. Most of the bacteria we want is attached to a substrate, not free-floating. Any damage you did will repair in 24 hours at worst. Ease up on the feeding if you are concerned.

Yup, temperature swings can be stressful to the fish. Any way to warm the water before putting it in? I actually put the dechlorinator directly in the tank, and then run water straight from the tap into the tank. That way I can set the temperature at the tap to match the tank. (Accuracy limited to my sense of touch--I don't use a thermometer to match it.) I've done it that way for years (from my aquarium days) and never had a problem.

On the bright side, I'm glad to know I'm not a nut case to be claiming that I've had problems poisoning my fish with kelp tea. Now you can show me up: I poisoned my fish -twice- with kelp tea before I got it through my thick skull that I shouldn't use it. I bet you can learn it with only one poisoning!

Fortunately I didn't need to de-chlorinate, I have well water. At least it happens to be a ph of 7.6 which is the same ph as my tank.

I just panic'd and forgot about the temp difference, I could have easily added warmer water by running a hose to the kitchen faucet. *smacks forehead*

It's got me wondering, what is in kelp that causes this?
This is what I used
Kelp meal
kelp is the only ingredient on the box


-Stevo

Mine is also just ground up kelp. Organic, even. I have no idea what is doing it, but I have now relegated my kelp meal to be used in the dirt garden only.

I am successfully using chelated iron (which really has lots of other trace minerals, too) now in the AP system, but am being very conservative on the amounts. My first dosing was only 3 tablespoons in 125gal. I have been adding more chelated iron every few days to make up for my deficiencies, and am testing the iron level in the water. I still do not have measurable iron in the water, although the plants are greening nicely. They must be grabbing the iron as fast as I put it in.

I've been googling a bit and found that kelp is naturally high in iodine.
I'm going to keep looking, this is really bugging me.


-Stevo

Stevo, don't add the salt slowly. You need to shock the ich to kill them. They need a sudden change in salinty to burst their cell walls and kill them. Adding slowly allows them to adjust to the changes and won't do the job.

Janet, does your chelated iron have copper and other things in it?

I checked levels tonight,
PH- steady at 7.6
NH4- 0
NO2- 1 ppm
NO3- 10 ppm

I had expected the numbers to be lower considering the 2 water changes.

Fish are acting normal, I added the remaining 6lbs of the salt and the temp is up to 72f (from 68 ) it should reach 80 in a few days. How long before I should see improvement with the ICH. I do have those spare tanks if I need to setup a quarantine tank.

-Stevo

Artie,
if you read through this ICH you should be able to find some useful information....from memory if the water temp remains below 72F (24C), the ICH cycle takes 2 weeks, if you can raise the temp above 72F then the time will be reduced to 4-5 days.

Read the link and that info is all in there

DD, yes, there is a bit of copper. I was worried about that, but the fish are showing no ill effects. Contains Magnesium 0.50%, Boron 0.02%, Copper 0.25%, Iron 5.00%, Manganese 0.25%, and Zinc 0.50%.
It's made by Bonide.

I also got another one to try after the Bonide. It is by Bio-Genesis and has guaranteed analysis: Soluble Potash (K20) 1.0%; Water Soluble Magnesium (Mg) 0.5%; Sulfur (S); Combined 3.0%; Boron (B) 0.02%; Water Soluble Copper (Cu) 0.05%; Water Soluble Iron (Fe) 2.0%; Water Soluble Manganese (Mn) 2.0%; Molybdenum (Mo) 0.0005%; and Water Soluble Zinc (Zn) 3.0% derived from Lamgbeinite, Sodium Borate, Copper Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Sodium Molybdate, Zinc Sulfate, Citric Acid is used as a chelating agent.

Both are available here: http://homeharvest.com/traceandminorelements.htm

Yep, key thing with the ich is that its only treatable in its free swimming stage.

so with a 4-5 day life cycle you'd take it out to say 10 days just to be sure you caught any "straglers" that had just begun their cycle

makes it much longer in the cooler temps. If the fish can withstand 30C to 31C temps for a few days then this also helps more as its beyond the tolerance range for the ich full stop, but its also very high for most fish.

Main thing is to remove all stresses to help fishes immune system. So, no temp fluctuation, no ammonia or nitrite (cut back on the feed) and have a high DO

Janet, last Summer after my goldfish started dying I wondered about the same product I had been adding. I now have a spray that only has iron in it and nothing else. I don't know if the stuff you have will cause problems, but the fish are supposedly very sensitive to copper and zinc both. The chelating may make them less toxic?

My husband tells me that in cases of lead poisoning, the remedy is to administer a chelating agent. Yet if you buy an iron supplement to take orally, it will be chelated. So I guess the chelated metals "move" better? Where the "moving" is either into or out of an organism. I don't really understand it.

Chelation for heavy metal toxicity uses an agent that binds the metals with a protein. Chelated minerals are minerals bound to a protien which makes them soluble in water and more mobile in the body.
Metals have free electrons making them conductive, but also giving them, by nature a positive charge. In our bodies, the alimentary canal has a positive charge, so in metalic form, minerals have a hard time being absorbed. they are only readily absorbed in chelate or colloidal form.

correct me if i'm wrong, but from the reading i did a while ago it seems that differnt chelation agents are used for the differnt "purposes" if the protien is readily absorbed by the body then it facilitates the absorbtion of the mineral. If it is not then when it binds to the mineral it makes it less bioavailable. ie detox of heavy metals?

AM i on the right track?

Exactly.
Chelation therapy finds protiens and other compounds that have an affinity for metals (preferably heavy metals) and bonds to them. Some of these do a good job of drawing the metals from the body at a cellular level, some of the strongest chelation agents don't distinguish between types of metals.
Chelated minerals use proteins that have a loose affinity for the minerals, so that when the body absorbs the protien, the metal is also absorbed, then the separation is done as it courses about your body. Fascinating subject...
By the way, some of the better chelation agents (not as strong, but strongly differentiate between heavy metals and the beneficial minerals that your body needs are: cilantro, chlorella, and duckweed. (Chelation from AP!)