Oh. I googled Saginaw and it said it was in Michigan.
| Backyard Aquaponics http://byap.backyardmagazines.com/forum/ |
|
| Calculate food production http://byap.backyardmagazines.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=20093 |
Page 1 of 2 |
| Author: | wbahha [ Jan 1st, '14, 16:23 ] |
| Post subject: | Calculate food production |
Hi guys, I have a few questions about calculating the food production that a farm can cover a county that has 1000 people 1) How big the land I am going to use for this project for the same number of people? "I hope I can see an equation" 2) What should I keep in mind if I am thinking about having a big farm instead of small farms for a huge project that may cover a whole country? 3) I heard that any project should not have more budget that US$200 per square meter for an Aquaponic project, is that true? Thanks |
|
| Author: | coachchris [ Jan 1st, '14, 23:44 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
WB, this should be an interesting thread. I have no clue to your formula...only that you would need a pretty large operation to supply 1000 people. Even then, you're going to be supplementing them, unless it's a survivalist type thing. My system with GH(greenhouse) is around 200 sq ft and is about very close to your $200.00 per square meter figure. I'm only 5 months in and can't estimate total food production, but can't see it sustaining more then a few people when it's 100%. There are some very experienced APers on here that can most likely give you better numbers that they have over time. One thing I can tell you is a large project like that is going to be very costly, and it better have some solid consulting going in, or it will be a money pit. Better to start small and then expand, then break the bank and find out how hard it can be. Mistakes can be costly. Not playing devil's advocate or trying to change your mind, but there are a lot of things that need to happen in a large AP system for it to be successful, and if one doesn't have a firm understanding of the science behind it, I would err on the side of caution. |
|
| Author: | Charlie [ Jan 2nd, '14, 07:02 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
wbahha wrote: 3) I heard that any project should not have more budget that US$200 per square meter for an Aquaponic project, is that true? What Stuart was saying here is that a cost to build per m2 for a hydro system is approx $200m2. Im not sure if AP would be similar as also inicated in that thread by the cost of the UES. If you are really seroius about feeding 1000 people from an aquaponics system you really need to go visit a large operational commercial system, although I doubt they would give you any associated costs. Much the same way as you wont find many real life figures on this forum because there is no one here operating a system that large. Ryan is probably involved in the biggest and he keeps most figures to himself as they are proprietary. Visit one of the very few operational farms, build a small system and learn about raising fish and veg (AP) then start working on your own figures from there. |
|
| Author: | Stuart Chignell [ Jan 2nd, '14, 07:58 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
It depends. What sort of system, what sort of crops, what level of technology, what level of labour requirements, what level of climate control. There are no simple answers. Remember though that scale is very important. Large systems are much cheaper than small systems on a per m2 basis. |
|
| Author: | wbahha [ Jan 2nd, '14, 08:27 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
Charlie and coachchris first I would like to thank you for your reply. I am trying to figure out how big land do I need to feed 1000 people (Is an example only, so I can put my real number in an equation". Also, about the money let's say money is not a problem. I know that I am going to need an expert in the project, but before that I need to have an equation for the land and the cost. Stuart Chignell thank you too for your reply. The system will cover most of the fruit, vegetable, flower, and fish. Also, let's say it is the only food source for the 1000 people to feed in. Therefore, the system is going to be modern like solar energy, pumps with a high HP.. etc.. I really did study about aquaponic, and I have a sopnser who is a businessman and he needs to know an average cost for such a project. |
|
| Author: | Stuart Chignell [ Jan 2nd, '14, 08:59 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
wbahha wrote: Charlie and coachchris first I would like to thank you for your reply. I am trying to figure out how big land do I need to feed 1000 people (Is an example only, so I can put my real number in an equation". The fish don't take up much space especially if you are following standard commercial RAS philosophies of large tanks to reduce labour requirements. If you are using tiny tanks (10,000L) then space required will be a lot more than if you are using large tanks (400m3). To keep things simple a high tech GH can produce around 800 tonnes /ha of green things (lettuce, salad greens, herbs) but this is very dependent on the management of the system and the varieties grown. If you want a ball park figure it will do but that is all it is good for. Some AP researchers believe they can duplicate or even better hydro tomato yields of around 80kg per annum / m2. Ryan is the one to talk to about fruiting plants. That can give you rough figures to do back of the envelope calcs. wbahha wrote: Also, about the money let's say money is not a problem. I know that I am going to need an expert in the project, but before that I need to have an equation for the land and the cost. Therefore, the system is going to be modern like solar energy, pumps with a high HP.. etc.. That means you probably want a glasshouse with all the toys. In Australian dollars that is around $200/m2 some components may be cheaper in the states due to your dollar and/or available local suppliers. Once you have the GH you then need to add the AP system. Then you need to add all the infrastructure that will service the operation. Workshop, staff facilities, packing and processing, water storage, etc. As the scale goes up things get relatively cheaper but the total bill begins to get huge. |
|
| Author: | Domani [ Jan 2nd, '14, 10:31 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
I think this is a case of "you can do it, but better you don't". |
|
| Author: | Stuart Chignell [ Jan 2nd, '14, 11:24 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
A concern that I would have is in a market as well integrated as the States why design a system to meet the fruit and veg needs for just a thousand people. While the overall operation would be large the production of individual crops would be small. If people were to eat 100g of tomatoes per day that is ~36t per year which at 80kg/m2 is only ~455m2 which for a tomato greenhouse is tiny. Since many of the economies of scale are realised on a crop basis producing many small crops limits the ability to achieve economies of scale. |
|
| Author: | Charlie [ Jan 2nd, '14, 11:28 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
He's a student in Saudi Arabia |
|
| Author: | Stuart Chignell [ Jan 2nd, '14, 11:53 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
Oh. I googled Saginaw and it said it was in Michigan.
|
|
| Author: | Charlie [ Jan 2nd, '14, 12:44 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
Actually, I just went back to double check and it seems he is in Michigan but wants to build the system in Saudi Arabia? This was the opening sentance on another thread.. "My name is Waheed S. Bahha, I am a student at SVSU in Saginaw MI. I am looking for a commercial scale aquaponic system that is going to be built in my country Saudi Arabia." woops |
|
| Author: | Stuart Chignell [ Jan 2nd, '14, 13:55 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
So he is in MI but the system will be in Saudi? |
|
| Author: | Charlie [ Jan 2nd, '14, 15:00 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
Seems so, we may need more info.. |
|
| Author: | Mazarron [ Jan 2nd, '14, 18:16 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
Hi wbahha, check out Earthan Group Pty on F'book. They are building (Near completed) a large commercial AP system in Dubai; if you are in the Kingdom then you can see that one more easily. The average human eats 3 tonnes of food per annum; that figure includes meat and dairy produce. So I would guess that an average human eats about 1500Kg of vegetables. If this is correct your 1000 people will need an output of 1,500 tonnes per annum. Don't get confused with output equalling input; you will have plant loss so head for 2,000 tonnes output. This is a very big system needing very big support and a very big wallet. |
|
| Author: | Stuart Chignell [ Jan 2nd, '14, 18:35 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Calculate food production |
2000t of specialised production about 10-12mil. Diversified production 
|
|
| Page 1 of 2 | All times are UTC + 8 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group https://www.phpbb.com/ |
|