Backyard Aquaponics
A place to discuss aquaponics

Yes, I'm new here, and yes, this is my second post in a row; but I just have so much to ask and you all are obviously the people to answer!

I remember seeing someone's post that he started out using one of these:
http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html/sr ... B000ECTBUO

perhaps it was Murray.

It's the cheapest 600 gallons I can find. I know it wont last long; but if it can get me through one season it'd help me get a grip on all this stuff. As a bonus, I get to feed my family healthy foods.

Anyway, here's another, "cheap" solution which is basically a modified version of my original idea, but I'm thinking I should go cheap. If any of you have used something like this in the past, what were your results? I assume you no longer use them, but did it get you by the learning curve? Was it worth it? Should I even bother, or just put it off until I can afford a decent tank?

Here's the pix of how the idea would work-out with the kiddy pool:

That was Joel -- Earthbound. The inflateable pool sprang a leak and made a mess. Look at Rubbermaid stock tanks like this:
http://www.stockyardsupply.com/page11/index2.html
a 100gal will cost about the same as your kiddie pool, or for an extra $100, you can get the 300gal. I have learned to go ahead and buy quality. It's cheaper in the long run. If you are concerned about cost, scale down rather than getting stuff that's going to break down and leak. Or implement in phases. That's what I'm doing. See here:
http://www.backyardaquaponics.com/forum ... .php?t=735
That's my 2 cents anyway.

Re your alternate plans--don't eliminate your grow beds. If you have to eliminate something, make it the float beds. Grow beds provide the media for bacteria to grow on. The bacteria convert the ammonia to nitrite and then nitrate. Without bacteria, your fish will all swim upside-down very quickly.

I saw your indoor setup while perusing... Very inspirational!

Onto the float beds.. I never intended to eliminate anything, was just showing "Layers" of the design, so people could understand what I was talking about. Only thing that is changed from original design is the tanks become one big, cheapo tank

Thanks so much for the advice, it is certainly noted.

Also, as I pointed out in another post, I think I only accounted for about 36 cubic feet of growbed.... for a 600-gallon tank i'd need that to be more like 120 cubic feet. So three more beds... and four-times the gravel to clean

Or, like you said... I could start a wee smaller!

But cleaning gravel is fun!!! You can also float plants directly in the fishtank, although the tilapia would probably see that as a personal salad bar unless you protect the roots.

OK, glad you were just showing layers rather than removing growbeds. I was worried.

I wish we had those rubbermaid products here in Aus - so bloody cheap even after taking into consideration exchange rate.

mmmm love rubbermaid! Yo bh the grow bed requirement ie (size/ number) is directly related to stocking densities of fishies in the pond not necessarly how big your pond is. So you could have as many grow beds as your fish population could support or as few. Nice design show more?

Yeah, GF's got it. If you stock lower densities, you need less gravel. My system runs 3:2 fish water to gravel, finished fish in there will be around 2 kg's per 100 litres

Thanks guys, I'll have to remember that fish ratio is more important than water ratio. I do want to stock for optimum levels, but slowly and methodically, hoping not to lose any premium fish (I'm going to shoot for no dead goldies either, but I'm prepared to lose a few for the cause).

I'm thinking of how to optimize that for space, I'll be working some more on it, especially as those diagrams aren't really to scale or anything.

I've been thinking about the floater beds, and think it should work-out OK. I'm basing that thought on the notion that the measurements at one end of the water is the same as the other end. All actually feeding and restoring is done through osmosis, so the water on the flow tables should only be missing the fecal matter. I'm hoping to use this in a way to stretch available square footage without the need for all the heavy, possibly expensive, high-maintenance media.

If anyone thinks this notion is somehow flawed, I'd love to hear it. Otherwise I think I may be on to something and am excited for signs of first thaw (long ways away, going to build small indoors in the meantime[thanks again for the inspiration Janet]).

Ooooh, I just love inspiring people!!!

There is no wrong answer. There is no right answer. Build what you think is right based on your best understanding and your own personal goals. Then be flexible and adjust as you learn!

I agree with ya on the starting a small system while you wait for winters end, will give you some bacteria to seed your big system with as well as get you on your way to playing with it all. Sounds like your system will work fine, the fish solids are not really needed is a system its just an added benifit of gravel to get rid of them in a perfect world.

Hi Janet,

Thanks for that link to the plastic feed troughs. That looks more "doable" than some of the options available here, and they are pretty cheap! We have been considering ferrocement, and steel "Australian" tanks, like Joels. I may tag team a container from the US with some others and get the components shipped to Belize.

Okay, lets say I wanted to use a bunch of these tanks for an AP system with 5 or 6 grow beds. Lets say, for example, that I used a 625 gallon Farmmaster tank for the fish.... and then a series of 50 gallon Rubbermaid feed tanks for the grow beds, maybe even making them step from one tank to the next, to maximize flow. Lift wouldn't need to be much and could easily be accomodated with a good pump.

Questions for you (and anyone), is there a ratio of grow bed to tank size and tank size to stocking density that is optimal? Would tyhe shallow depth of the grow nbeds of 12 inches, and the dept of the tank, at 24 inches, present a problem?

BTW, I really like your small inhouse system! Very nice.

C

Thanks Christopher. And by the way, I went out to your website. Waaay Cool!!! Hmmm, Belize isn't that far....stop in El Salvador, then Barbados, then Belize...hmmm.

The link I provided was just an easy one for me to find. (They probably wonder why so much trafic from an AP site. LOL). See if you can find a source out of Florida or something. The tanks are pretty ubiquitous here.

The best ratio for grow beds to tanks is what will fit it your space OK, the current thinking is that Growbed:tank should be 2:1, by volume. Many of the systems here are not that high, including at least one of Joel's systems. Mine is closer to 1.2:1 because....(drumroll)...that's what fits in the space I had. Stocking density is going to be based on your skill as a fishkeeper, first and foremost. Assuming that you are a skilled fishkeeper, each 4gal growbed:2gal tank could support 1 pound liveweight of fish. So 4gal:2gal:1lb. I would build your system at 2:1, and stock the first batch or two of fish very lightly until you know the real limits of your specific implementation and skill set. Have some water testing strips packed in your container from the US so you can see what you are doing.

Current thinking is that growbed depth of 12 inches is optimal. My belief is that the fish tank should be no less than 24 inches deep, but more if you are concerned about temperature fluctuations or if you have fish that get a bit nervous near the surface. My growbeds are 12 inches (the 50gal Rubbermaid), and the fish tank is 24 inches (the 150gal Rubbermaid). I love the idea of stairstepping the growbeds--maybe down a slope? Folks were playing with sequential stair-stepped auto-siphons a while ago. I can't remember who, but someone had a test going with a series of 4 buckets spilling one into the next. The biggest problem pointed out was that each growbed needed to be a foot higher than the previous one, so working on level ground quickly limited how many growbeds they could put in sequence.

I got sidetracked by the cool tanks, but I'm actually leaning toward a pond of some size, since my wife is drawn to pond culture and not so fond of AP (only in that the materials cost something other than sweat). I have tentattively sold her on the idea of AP as a "biological filtering mechanism", which has placated her, but... if I have a pond, 20x30, with varying dgrees of depth, we'd still need to filter out the fish waste.

Luckily for us, or unluckily, depending on the problem at hand, our land is 70 acres of hills! So stair stepping grow beds down a hill wouldn't be a huge issue, and takes advantage of the fact that half of our land is on a south facing slope....

Christopher.
I live in El Salvador and one of my biggest frustrations has been finding a good growbed at a reasonable price. I think you are probably familiar with Rotoplas water tanks. At least here they are everywhere. I came across a catalog that shows they make plastic cattle feeders, waterers, and cow licks. They can be seen here:

http://www.tecnoplas.com.mx/productos/bebederos.html I have an email into them to see if they can give me a distributer's info nearby. I have not actually seen them, only pictures. They are mad in Guatemala so for us, shipping would be much less than from the US. I will let you know what I find out.