Backyard Aquaponics
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CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
http://byap.backyardmagazines.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=5993		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  ivansng [ Aug 15th, '09, 23:35 ]
Post subject:  CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
Considering to use CHIFT PIST for my next system. I read the forum about it and one thing I am still not sure is, the piping from the Fish Tank to the Grow Beds.

It is obviously a requirement for the Fish Tank outlet to be higher than the grow beds, but can the piping run drop below the growbed outlet height (ie. run possibly underground) and then extend back up to the growbed outlet height when it is closer to the growbed? This is eliminates pipe runs that are "floating" in the air. Will this work?

If it will work, how high must the fish tank outlet height be compared to the growbed outlet height?

Also I intend using 40mm for the main run and then dropping down to 25mm very close to the growbed. 25mm Ball valve is cheaper than 40mm. Will this work?

Comments appreciated.
Author:  TCLynx [ Aug 16th, '09, 00:45 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
Yes, gravity plumbing can drop down and come back up.

However, please make sure you allow enough fall (or make the top level of the fish tank enough higher than the grow beds to allow the flow to work.) Exactly how much fall you need, well that will vary on plumbing size and flow rates.

How big is the system you are working on? I personally would advise larger plumbing for all but very small systems.

I have 3" plumbing comming from my big fish tank (CHIFT PIST) and then I used uniseals to put 1" stubs with ball valve out to three of my grow beds. Then the pipe drops down below the pathway and comes back up to feed another grow bed. There is a T and a riser pipe at either side of where the pipe drops below the pathway to make sure there are no vapor locks. Just make sure the riser pipe above the T goes High enough that water doesn't come out the time (basically make it as high as the top of the fish tank.)
Link to where the CHIFT PIST conversion happens in my system.
http://backyardaquaponics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2640&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=1200
and here is a shot of where the pipe drops down under the pathway. Sorry the image might be a bit confusing with the NFT pipes in the background but they are not attached to the CHIFT PIST piping.
Image
Author:  Food&Fish [ Aug 16th, '09, 03:06 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
Check out Mizzie system he is droping to the floor and back up
Author:  countryboy [ Aug 16th, '09, 07:57 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
If it drops to the floor and comes back up, how much solid stuff will collect at the bottom of the 'U'? Need to be cleaned periodically? Or, will backpressure from the buildup force it to break up and wash through?

Thx,

CB
Author:  ivansng [ Aug 16th, '09, 10:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
TCLynx wrote:
Yes, gravity plumbing can drop down and come back up.

However, please make sure you allow enough fall (or make the top level of the fish tank enough higher than the grow beds to allow the flow to work.) Exactly how much fall you need, well that will vary on plumbing size and flow rates.

How big is the system you are working on? I personally would advise larger plumbing for all but very small systems.


Well it is a small (quarantine) system. FT about 200L and sump about 100-160L (depends on the gravity drain). 4 pots which would be about 50-60L filled with pea gravel. The idea was originally to just have 2 fish tank that are connected together at the bottom, meshed to stop migration of fish. When quarantine is needed, all the existing fishes can be transferred to the other tank, leaving one tank for quarantine. Intend on using goldfishes, pretty hardy and cheap.

But that idea went out the window went I found out that I cannot dig the tank in at one of the locations due to existing pipework for soakwells. But all is not lost, hence CHIFT PIST. Still allows me to have two tanks. Plus I think it would give me practise for my bigger future system.

Hence would 40mm piping fromt FT to GB and actually also 40mm back to Sump, but all 4 pots feeds into a common 40mm run.

I will look into the anti-vapour lock piping a bit more before posting questions.

So I thought about CHIFT PIST.
Author:  ivansng [ Aug 16th, '09, 11:02 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
Ignore the last line of my post. Retype some of my post and did not realise that the last line was still there.

Food&Fish wrote:
Check out Mizzie system he is droping to the floor and back up


Had a look. Looks great. Thanks.
Author:  bentaz [ Aug 16th, '09, 11:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
ivansng wrote:

Well it is a small (quarantine) system. FT about 200L and sump about 100-160L (depends on the gravity drain). 4 pots which would be about 50-60L filled with pea gravel. The idea was originally to just have 2 fish tank that are connected together at the bottom, meshed to stop migration of fish. When quarantine is needed, all the existing fishes can be transferred to the other tank, leaving one tank for quarantine. Intend on using goldfishes, pretty hardy and cheap.

But that idea went out the window went I found out that I cannot dig the tank in at one of the locations due to existing pipework for soakwells. But all is not lost, hence CHIFT PIST. Still allows me to have two tanks. Plus I think it would give me practise for my bigger future system.



if iit is a quarantine tank then you will not want any other fish in the system, seperate tanks but its still the same water and still the same nasties.
if you only planing on a smallish set up why not just quarintine in a fish tank where you can see the fish well?
Author:  ivansng [ Aug 16th, '09, 11:57 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
bentaz wrote:
if iit is a quarantine tank then you will not want any other fish in the system, seperate tanks but its still the same water and still the same nasties.
if you only planing on a smallish set up why not just quarintine in a fish tank where you can see the fish well?


Well for starters, it has to be assumed that the small (quarantine) system is relatively free of nasties to start with. Hard to know, but I will only have goldfishes in small setup, hence I am fine if the sick fish passes the nasties onto the goldfishes. If the goldfishes do die as well, then there is something seriously wrong with the tank where the sick fish came from.

Well part of the drive to build this small system is that I have four self watering pots that I can easily converted to flood and drain pots. Because the pots are usually at one end of the house, I often neglect fertilizing the plants. The plan is to grow tallish plants, like tomatoes, capsicum, cucumber, etc.

Also a bit of experimenting experience of building a system myself I suppose.

So the quarantine concept is really a "hmm.. can be used as a quarantine tank as well" thought.
Author:  TCLynx [ Aug 17th, '09, 03:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
So basically this is a "first system" and hence a bit smaller and will "become" the Quarantine system in the future. Ok.

What is the pump for this system (as in what is the flow rate and the plumbing from the pump up to the fish tank?) Make sure your plumbing from the fish tank to the grow beds and from the grow beds back to sump tank is quite a bit larger than the pump plumbing. I've got 1 1/2 inch pipe from my pump to the fish tank and if I let all the flow go there (I have some flow bypassed back into the sump tank normally) I can overwhelm the 3 inch plumbing that feeds to the grow beds. Hope that info helps you. As in if your pump as 20 mm pipe up to the fish tank, then it's possible that 40 mm pipe might be overwhelmed by it, thus you may need either bigger gravity drain pipe or you have to bypass some of the flow to back into the sump tank.
Author:  ivansng [ Aug 17th, '09, 08:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: CHIFT PIST FT to GB Piping
TCLynx wrote:
So basically this is a "first system" and hence a bit smaller and will "become" the Quarantine system in the future. Ok.


Yes, a bit confusing. But I am glad I went the BYAP kit path as I gained lots of experience.

TCLynx wrote:
What is the pump for this system (as in what is the flow rate and the plumbing from the pump up to the fish tank?) Make sure your plumbing from the fish tank to the grow beds and from the grow beds back to sump tank is quite a bit larger than the pump plumbing. I've got 1 1/2 inch pipe from my pump to the fish tank and if I let all the flow go there (I have some flow bypassed back into the sump tank normally) I can overwhelm the 3 inch plumbing that feeds to the grow beds. Hope that info helps you. As in if your pump as 20 mm pipe up to the fish tank, then it's possible that 40 mm pipe might be overwhelmed by it, thus you may need either bigger gravity drain pipe or you have to bypass some of the flow to back into the sump tank.


The pump I am considering is 2400L/hr pump with max height 2.4m. http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190325433766&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:ITI believe at 1m head, it is about 1000-1200L/hr. I intend to run 25mm (could use 20mm as well) pipe from ST to FT, 40mm pipe from FT to Growpots but drops down to 20mm at the growpots. Working on a flood and drain, the standpipe is 25mm with a small hole (5-6mm) for slow drain. For a very short run, drain is 25mm from growpot but gets connected to a 40mm pipe. All four pots gets connected to the same 40mm drainpipe.

I also intend to make sure that I have an bypass as suggested to divert some flow back to the sump tank if required.

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