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| HELP! problem with water level balance http://byap.backyardmagazines.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=26474 |
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| Author: | phirestalker [ Jan 3rd, '16, 11:32 ] |
| Post subject: | HELP! problem with water level balance |
I am trying to set up a small system in the house and the pump bringing the water down from the 75 gallon tank is coming out faster than the water going back into the tank from the collection tank below the plants. The pumps are the same size so what can I do to even things out? |
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| Author: | Gunagulla [ Jan 3rd, '16, 11:43 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
A simple fix would be to put a tap on the fast one to slow it down. However, a system that relies on 2 pumps having identical output to prevent overflows, dry tanks etc is probably going to be prone to disaster. Can't it be rigged up so that you only need one pump? |
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| Author: | Yavimaya [ Jan 3rd, '16, 12:14 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
you will never, NEVER get two pumps balanced, you may seem to get them close, but in a week or a month or so something will overflow. use one pump only. |
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| Author: | Brian [ Jan 3rd, '16, 12:42 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
tee and a couple of taps and feed some of the faster pump back into the tank. there is a lot of history about why most small systems are set up with one pump and a slo. But at the end of the day , it is your system :-) |
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| Author: | Yavimaya [ Jan 3rd, '16, 13:00 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
without getting both pumps to pump the exact same ML/sec etc, then one will always overflow eventually. |
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| Author: | phirestalker [ Jan 3rd, '16, 13:23 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
the house isn't stable enough for the shelving that would require besides it being a sore thumb in the middle of the kitchen. If I used smaller tubing would it make the pump run slower? I intend to get some water level sensors with a shut off, we are home most of the time. |
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| Author: | nosliwmas [ Jan 3rd, '16, 13:31 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
Hey, PS! Can you draw us a picture, or paint a pretty picture with words, that would provide a clear description of the entire system? So you've got a 75 G (fish?) tank that pumps down (why not gravity feed?) to a growbed (of what size?) and than drains into a sump tank (of what size?) which is then pumped back up to the 75 G tank? Is that the system? Ain't troubleshooting fun! 
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| Author: | phirestalker [ Jan 3rd, '16, 13:41 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
I know a two pump system is a terrible idea, and I thank you for warning me. I just can't think of a way to configure it because the fish tank is already so high that I can't put plants above it. I would have to buy another piece of furniture maybe a fish tank stand that sits lower, but we were stupid and got the fish first so I'm SICK and TIRED of cleaning the damn tank every 3 days and want some plants cleaning the water so here I am. I am going to have to save money for a tank stand and refigure it for a one pump system when I can. I have a 75g fish tank on a 36" high table. the sump tank is on a 13" high platform and is only about 30 gallons. On top of the sump tank sit 10g or less totes with holes and a bell siphon on the bottom of them. |
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| Author: | Gunagulla [ Jan 3rd, '16, 13:58 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
I have a 9500l tank that is above all the GBs, up to 4metres above the lowest ones, but only need one pump, so it definitely is doable with a <300l tank! You need a solids lift overflow to get water from the FT to the GBs. A diagram of your plumbing setup would be very useful. |
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| Author: | phirestalker [ Jan 3rd, '16, 14:06 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
I'll do you one better. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YlkYEHb37nfRZROMIfvv7APQ9TGR57s5-Q/view?usp=sharing ps. ignore the empty tank on the floor, it is just stored there. |
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| Author: | Gunagulla [ Jan 3rd, '16, 16:20 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
Tricky- rectangular tanks don't easily clear the fish poo, even with decent water circulation there will be dead spots where it accumulates. To put a SLO in, you would need to put a hole through the side of the tank at the top water level, and distribute to the GBs from there. I'd think about adding a bit more media to those tubs too. |
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| Author: | CJ-California [ Jan 4th, '16, 04:12 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
This one is though. I think i would... Move the FT to the bottom. (new Sump) Move all GB to top. Make all GB a contestant flow/hight gb. Convert current sump to another GB. Things to remember. Use both pumps to a single entry point. i.e. both in ft/sump to first GB (then daisy chain) or makeshift collection manifold. You will have to clean/maintain the FT/Sump and pumps for debris. keep an eye on your ammonia level. I still think you will need to do water changes but this should make it a bit easier and make the duration between changes a bit more manageable. Good Luck. 
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| Author: | nosliwmas [ Jan 5th, '16, 12:52 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
phirestalker, Okay, so the problem for doing gravity feed from the FT to the GB's on to the Sump is that the FT is a nice glass aquarium and tough to cut an overflow drain hole in the side, right? Attachment: phirestalker_aquarium_aquaponics.jpg [ 108.27 KiB | Viewed 3362 times ] So then, what about putting a small "sump-tank" up along-side the big FT on top and connect it to the FT with a U-siphon to keep the small sump at the same water-level as the FT? Then if the small sump has an overflow drain gravity feeding the growbeds, it could be back to having a single pump in the lower sump... The pump in the lower sump pumps water into the fish tank which also pushes up the water-level in the small up-top sump until it gets to the small sump's overflow drain which then flows down to the growbeds and then back to the lower sump to repeat. I'm talking about a simple U-siphon / bridge siphon as shown in this video keeping two side-by-side sump tanks at the same level. An arrangement like this would make the problem go away, right? Plus you'd cut your pumping cost in half AND free up 1 pump to be a spare! What's not to love about that?  -- Sam |
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| Author: | Gunagulla [ Jan 5th, '16, 14:58 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
As water warms up, it air comes out of solution, and can lead to a break in the syphon. I would not want to be relying on such a syphon being maintained, when the result of an air lock would be water being pumped all over the floor. I'll suggest that if you can't put a hole in the side of your FT for a SLO, you need to put the FT at the bottom and pump from it. |
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| Author: | nosliwmas [ Jan 5th, '16, 15:43 ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! problem with water level balance |
Gunagulla wrote: As water warms up, it air comes out of solution, and can lead to a break in the syphon. I would not want to be relying on such a syphon being maintained, when the result of an air lock would be water being pumped all over the floor. So a bridge siphon like this is not reliable enough to use because of air coming out of solution? I see a good number of folks using them with aquaponics. I wonder if any using bridge siphons reading this have real world data on how often they must bleed air out of the siphon. I suppose the bridge siphon could be built with a transparent bit to keep an eye on things. To save the floor in a worst case, perhaps something like this can be put under the aquarium.  Minimize risk... for longer lived fish! -- Sam |
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